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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

So who went on a

118 replies

Leithlurker · 30/03/2013 19:18

Anti Bedroom Tax march and what one?

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AnitaKnightSavesTheWorld · 01/04/2013 18:27

(at 18:10)

AnitaKnightSavesTheWorld · 01/04/2013 18:26

What LRD said.

chibi · 01/04/2013 18:22

i think it is about why feminists are rubbish and doing it wrong, and how they perhaps ought to be a bit more like leithlurker

LRDtheFeministDragon · 01/04/2013 18:20

I would like to know that too, please!

IsBella · 01/04/2013 18:19

What is this thread about please?

Confused
LRDtheFeministDragon · 01/04/2013 18:11

leith - I quoted your pro-sex-work views, and if you read my post, you will see my explanation is there too.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 01/04/2013 18:10

We all know many single parents are women.

I am not sure why siblings sharing rooms is a feminist issue.

I do not see how either point makes you think feminists who disagree with anti-woman policies and/or feel unsafe with this sort of march, would suddenly ignore their principles to support it?

Leithlurker · 01/04/2013 18:10

You have not even shown that I am pro sex work though LRD, which parts of the quotes YOU choose, showes that I am in favour of prostitution, stripping, pole dancing, hooters, or any other form of the sex industry.

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Leithlurker · 01/04/2013 18:02

Another reason why this is a feminist issue although frankly I am surprised that I even need to explain why it is a feminist issue is:

Families are deemed to be over occupying if two siblings have their own room, so a brother and sister up to the age of 10 (I think) will be forced to share a room. Two siblings of the same sex will be forced to share a room till 12. Many single parents those headed by women, will be forced to leave their homes and move to smaller houses or find the extra money deducted from their housing benefit.

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LRDtheFeministDragon · 01/04/2013 18:01
Confused

Erm, the title is 'So who went on a'.

Did you mean it to be something else? If so, report the thread and get it changed to what it should be. There is no information whatsoever in the title!

I have already said that I don't agree with your pro-sex-work views. I am aware many people are much more pro sex work, but I'm afraid that doesn't make your views more palatable to me. I don't have to justify this: it is a really basic point for me and for a lot of feminists.

Leithlurker · 01/04/2013 17:57

You read the thread but not the title apparently, or LRD you would not have been badgering me for frankly useless and inappropriate information.

And again the accusation of being pro sex work, throw the mud it will stick eventually.

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Leithlurker · 01/04/2013 17:53

Do you know why the fathers group called it that Anita, and did you read the bit where I said that the welfare reforms as a whole, bedroom tax in particular will work against women just because they are women.

But to answer the point you raise in case I am accused of being Lazy. Fathers who live seperatly from their children and who have already got access arrangements, or who are trying to get access arrangements will be penalised by having a room in their home that children can use when they come to stay. It was suggested by Lord Fraud on radio 5 live to a father in this situation that he would have to downsize his house to one he could afford and buy a sofa bed for the kids to sleep on in the living room. I would say the implications for women are pretty large from this one aspect of the bedroom tax alone.

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LRDtheFeministDragon · 01/04/2013 17:47

I read the thread.

I just happen to disagree with you.

I liked the marches I went on because they didn't include people who were pro-sex-worker. I felt safe at them.

HTH.

chibi · 01/04/2013 17:46

if thousands of other women want to support and make common cause with people who don't see them as human, and who hold them in contempt is depressingly familiar but not a valid reason why i ought to as well

people willing to hang around hoping for scraps from those who despise them are probs beyond being hurt by me declining to join them anyway, but it sure is cute of you leithlurker to be so concerned on their behalf

Leithlurker · 01/04/2013 17:45

Because if you had read the bloody thread instead of coming here to tell me that you don't like me because you have a made up idea of what my views are on stuff you would have bloody seen that the marches had already taken place, in fact the clues are littered all over this thread not least by the reference to the sidebar with chibi about the event in Glasgow.

I asked people to talk about a march that they had BEEN on.

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AnitaKnightSavesTheWorld · 01/04/2013 17:44

The only info I've seen on the thread is that Shock piece that IsBella linked to. I wouldn't attend any March or stand with any organisation that has Dave Sherry speaking for them.

I'm yet to be convinced that the bedroom tax is actually a feminist issue - I've heard a father's rights group calling it a 'tax against fathers'.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 01/04/2013 17:37

I think it is lazy to refuse to answer questions about the topic, or to provide proper info in the OP. 'On the wind up' would be another apt term. If you want to promote this event, why on earth won't you tell us about it, tell us what's good about it, and convince us to support it? Sorry, but yes, your focus on 'why feminism is bad innit' does put me off attending and does make me suspect your motives.

This is not 'passive aggressive', it is simply me telling you why I don't feel convinced to go on the march.

I've looked in vain for any information on this thread about the march ... you couldn't be bothered to provide it. What a waste of time.

Ooh ... but Game of Thrones has downloaded now, so it's not all bad.

Leithlurker · 01/04/2013 17:33

Oh that certainly is passive aggressive calling me lazy when I have spent most of my time answering accusations or defending why this is in fwr. I have explained when I have been able to, I have supplied information when asked. I have not justified my existence as I do not feel it necessaries to do so, why the heck are you still posting on this thread any way. You clearly have no interest in the issue only in telling me that I would not be your chosen marching buddy.

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SabrinaMulhollandJjones · 01/04/2013 17:29

I only came on this thread to read LRD Smile

But, oh look, it's a man telling us how to do feminism again. Hmm

LRDtheFeministDragon · 01/04/2013 17:29

Btw, issuing threats to feminists is really not the way to get anyone on your side.

Leithlurker · 01/04/2013 17:28

Anita, apart from the swp, would you stand with the other people who were on the protests?

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LRDtheFeministDragon · 01/04/2013 17:28

leith - I disagree with your views, as I understand them, in quotations such as those. Because of that, I don't want to go on your march.

Why do you think this is something I'm not allowed to make up my own mind about?

This isn't me being remotely passive-aggressive ... this is just me explaining why I wouldn't want to go on this march.

If you had a serious desire to promote this march or this cause, I think you would talk about it, instead of taking pot shots.

Your expectation that feminists should not be principled, and should be instantly available to support an agenda you're too lazy to explain for yourself, is pretty depressing. You do get that we might actually have an agenda of our own? And marches of our own?

Your posts suggest to me that you support the abuse of women. Sorry, but they do. If you seriously meant something else, I'm so pleased to hear it. But, sadly, I don't feel keen to join the march. You'd have to do a lot more to convince me that it's a worthwhile thing to do.

Leithlurker · 01/04/2013 17:24

Should also add that I am not in favour of abuse full stop. But I do not see that anyone trying to live the life that they want to using legal and consensual practices as abuse.

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AnitaKnightSavesTheWorld · 01/04/2013 17:22

I agree with chibi & LRD. You need to be careful who you stand with. I don't personally agree with the bedroom tax but I wouldn't stand with an organisation that brushes the rape of a teenager under the carpet.

Leithlurker · 01/04/2013 17:19

Nice work LRD, I knew you would rise to the Challenge. However having selected and carefully presented out of context, you still do not show why these are pro sex work or prostitution, you show examples that you do not agree with or find problematic.

The fact that you say these quotes mean I am in favour of one persons rights to abuse others is an interpretation which your entitled to make. Your not entitled to extrapolate nor or you correct to extrapolate that I am in favour of prostitution or trafficked women or young children which is what you imply by using the "pro sex work" tag.

The last quote is particularly interesting, as you say "I find this particularly unpleasant because the focus is on sex workers ... as usual ... and not the people who abuse them. It's the happy hooker myth, plus some disturbingly misogynistic language about 'abolishing' abused women, or getting them 'off the street' so we can all feel 'nice"
Out of context you make a fair point, if though I remember rightly I said that in response to a discussion about why on these boards discussion of any sex work related topics gets turned in to a vitriolic and personal bun fight. So hence the only way to stop the level of Vitriol from both sides and actually make some progress on the main issues, would be etc. More a comment of the entrenched views of people like yourself LRD than that of the rights and wrongs of sex work.

But see this is more passive aggressive stuff from you, and here I am defending myself, yet again. If you and others have an issue with working with, or joining protests that might contain people with dodgy ideas, then the return is that all your hopes for feminism will be thwarted as it will only be by mass action that change will take place. You wont be there though so your not going to get what you want, you will have to rely on the likes of me and other dodgy women and men to deliver your feminist dreams.

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