Really proud of my 17 year old daughter

Because its social convention. And at least that ones relatively equal, it's deemed acceptable for neither men nor women to wang their genitals about.

I fail to see anything about women's boobs that makes them naturally more private, it's only the restrictions society places on them, irrespective of differences or not.

Men can lactate, men can grow breasts
Some women can't lactate (and most of the time we're not lactating), and may have chests that are also very different from their backs

We're not saying that if you're lactating, or if you have breasts bigger than an A cup you should cover them, or if they're small/not lactating you can walk around bare chested we're basing it purely on your sex.

Women do have biological differences, but biological attributes do not determine what you have to cover! If that were the case then perhaps it would be sensible for women to cover their breasts, and men their penises, and the rest could hang out. After all, there's really nothing to see on a woman's frontage - to borrow a turn of phrase, a woman's front is little different from her back (hairyness aside) so what does it matter showing it?

It's worse than that of course, because apparently not only do I have to keep my breasts covered, I also have to keep them 'under control' apparently it's scandalous for a woman to not wear a bra - yet mens bits can jiggle all they like.

I think that's what sets women's chests apart from men's - men's chests are little different from their backs. But women's are, like you pointed out, they are a whole "organ" because they feed infants and function. So they are extremely different from men's.

You might argue that the primary function of a willy is to wee. So why then, if your dd's argument for breasts being out is their functionality, can men not walk down the street with their willies out? Seeing as their primary function is to wee, not be ogled. Obviously they wouldn't actually be weeing whilst walking down the street.

Women are different from men. I am not sure why some people don't accept this. Women have babies because they have a uterus in their abdomen. Men don't. An average man is bigger and stronger than an average woman etc. that's why sports are generally divided. You don't see men v women in 100m Olympics! Plenty of other things can be equally done by men/women but that doesn't change the fact that there are significant differences.

Why wouldn't they? Swimming naked is quite nice actually. I wander around the house naked, would sleep naked if I wouldn't be attacked for a feed etc. I've swum and hung around topless on beaches abroad and no-one has batted an eyelid.

Again, the only reason we cover up is that it is the only socially acceptable way to do it in this particular society.

In other societies you would have felt under no pressure at all to cover up various bits - be they bottom or top end. For instance, thong bikinis in Brazil are common place, but would make many British women feel exposed. Or as a Malay in Malaysia you would feel that your whole body and head is private and not understand why the Chinese girls are fine about wandering around in short-shorts and a vest.

Agreed, Tei. Women should be free to air their boobs. In the pub, on the beach, in the paper...perhaps its just a British hang-up.

Whattya mean, women have to keep their boobs covered? Open the front page of the Sun, and there will be a pair proving you wrong.

When I was a small child, I would happily parade around naked. As I grew up, I didn't want to display my breasts/bum/fanjo. That's what makes them private. Why would anyone want (for eg) to go to a swimming pool and show their boobs to everyone?

Boobs are only private by social convention - in plenty of countries the culture doesn't seem them as significantly different to mens breasts.

Men with boobs aren't made to cover up, women with small boobs aren't allowed them out - it's not the boobs that is the issue, it's whether the chest is attached to a man or a woman, hence it's sexist.

I classified breasts as extra private parts. Mine are certainly private, aren't yours?

Men have willies and bums.
Women have fanjos, bums AND breasts. One extra, compared to men.

Yes, both sexes ave nipples, but women have whole boobs behind their nipples.

I haven't understood any explanations yet!

Why are women's breasts extra private as compared to men's breasts?

Arf at "extra private parts".

Men have nipples too, you know. Yet it's only women's that have become overly sexualised.

'Extra private parts'? - tee hee

"Women have extra private parts on their chests". Who classified breasts as "extra private parts"?

Really? I would be (bloody) delighted I had raised an active, thinking challenging and bold young woman.

I most certainly wouldn't be proud of my 17 year old if they used language like that.

Just saying.

I think I may have missed the point re men being able to go topless but not women. Women have extra private parts on their chests and men don't. Isn't that why it's ok for men to be topless - like in a swimming pool, men wear trunks but women wear costume/bikini so that fanjo and boobs covered? Please enlighten me!!

Indeed, slug. I've just skimmed through read John Stuart Mill's On Liberty and the chapter on free discussion has a paragraph on this. To paraphrase, it's something like you generally find the tone objectionable if it's voicing an opinion you don't like but find it quite acceptable if it's arguing for you.

'fuck all you patriarchal cunts' made me do an actual lolz.

Indeed

Go on, NT's DD!
I would quite like 'fuck all you patriarchal cunts' on a t-shirt.

see, it's just language

at juxtaposition of PP objecting to use of sexual swearwords but then going on to use the phrase 'you're basicly (sic) screwed'

I hang my head in shame