Really proud of my 17 year old daughter

Anyone who calls me "lady" had better watch it. >

Oh FGS. Can we just let the poor girl off. Yeah she was a bit sweary but she's only 17 and kudos to her for asking those questions so young.

I'm glad someone else hates the word Lady. It's one of those twisty words the big P is so good at. Ostensibly it's a compliment but has a fair bit of judgement inherent in it. I mean it replaced Gentlewoman cos that word morphed to mean prostitute and what's wrong with the word woman when it's at home. It's one of those pedestal words.

A bit like when Jade and her mum bullied Shilpa Shetty by calling her a Princess.

Your (sic) an English teacher?

Hahahahaha!

Yes candlestick, your right. It would be awful to have "
"a polite lady who doesn't say anything to anyone (who perhaps is in fear of being judged for her choice of vocabulary rather than encouraged to form opinions using whatever language she sees fit) "
for a daughter as you finely put.
Luckily we live in a society where young men and women receive an education that teaches them to be articulate, allows then to have a voice .perhaps your mixing this society up with one of Jane eyres.

'do you know his name'

I agree with SP1979 that "cunt" is a very nasty word, though some women think there's hope for it. I grumbled at young Ms Teakozy for using it, but we have to accept that she's like most girls--in spite of the best efforts by her parents, she doesn't "identify [herself] as feminist". If one day she does, then she might choose different words.

If we use the worst words every day (every hour? every minute?) what'll we be left with when things get really dire?

Hate the word lady.

Why does that person deem it offensive?

I find it patronising. But I also dislike Miss and Mrs. One of them annoying feminists me

Some people swear when they feel passionate and angry and use it for emphasis. I know I do.

Each to their own.

Your daughter sounds like she has a good foundation for a decent argument there OP

I think I'd rather have a sweary opinionated woman for a daughter than a polite lady who doesn't say anything to anyone (who perhaps is in fear of being judged for her choice of vocabulary rather than encouraged to form opinions using whatever language she sees fit)

Gosh, Really ? that's Interesting, do you know his name and the article?As a teacher of English at an all girls school I'd be intrigued to read that. The best in the country/world? When I studied feminisim in literature as part of my masters we were still using the British dictionary definition of the word Lady (Chiefly British )A general feminine title of nobility and other rank. We were not using the C word. We felt it was an extremely offensive disparaging term for women it is often now used as an insult to men degrading a woman further. I'm not sure I have seriously fucked up sparklyboots but you seem to know.

That's hilarious, sweetiepie1979, did you know that Professor of English at Warwick Uni (one of the top in the country/ world) has described 'lady' as 'the most vulgar word in the English language'? Cos if you were trying to avoid the use of offensive language, you just fucked up.

17 yo in swearing with/at her peers shocker.
Really?

Sounds like a real lady

I love your DD OP and I'd buy the FAYPC tshirt, teamed with a mumsnet scarf obviously.

Feminism and prudish tend to go hand in hand.

Nonsensical and wrong.

Regardless who is at fault you can't deny women who dress in skimpy clothes are more likely to be raped than women who cover up.

Ignorant and wrong

What a treat it is to have ramios with us tonight

All this fainting over a couple of swear words is making me lol too.

Well done to your dd, NT

it's a hard road she is stepping onto though

she will need a skin thicker than a rhino, and be ready for all those cunts to try and take her down

even on a so-called genteel middle class parenting site like MN, I am being picked at and goaded for standing up for women in a "nasty feminist manner" on 2 separate threads just this evening

not too many people stepping up to add their voice to mine either (apart from the few usual rather wonderful suspects, who equally get flak too)

all the best to her x

I'd buy that t-shirt.

Ramios, aha ha ha ha. We fems are such prudish fuckers, clearly. Check out the cunts on this thread! Course you'll have to ignore those fems demanding to have their boobs out in public.

OP I'd be so proud. I remember how terrifying it was to self identify as feminist at that age, and how I thought feminism equalled lesbian man-hating (cos that's what everyone at school thought), and thinking I was unlikely to score with such a label even if I didn't think it was really about lesbianism/ man hating. And I was quite interested in scoring, obvs, cos how else could you get sexual gratification (yip, totally in thrall to the PIV thing too)?

Course now I quite like the way it filters idiots, calling yourself a fem. And don't really remember why I thought it would mean social death to be a lesbian. & I know about actual sex, rather than the in-service-to-patriarchal-constructs kind. But those things are important at 17, no?

WRT the language, think OP' s daughter is responding to form in a way that further demonstrates her social awareness. She'd be an idiot to write an essay like that, or txt her parents in that way. But addressing herself to her target audience using the vernacular in which they commonly converse is smart.

Tei Men who walk around uncovered might get the odd look and a tut or a sigh, even a look of disgust.

Women are encouraged to do it and are then vilified for it by the press and by society. They are told they deserve what they get, that they are fair game and that they have no right to expect to be respected.

Like the passion, abhor the language.

Once more, from the top, for ramios.

The majority of rapes are committed by someone known to the victim. Clothing has nothing to do with it. Even the small percentage of stranger rapes are committed on victims in a cross section of clothing.

Most feminists are against page 3 because it objectifies women in the pages of a national newspaper - it normalises the viewing of women purely as sexual objects. It isn't prudery.

HTH.

I think the language was entirely age appropriate and I'm assuming she wouldn't use it with her Granny or at work. My kids know there's a time and place for all language. Really normal, ordinary, respectable people use language like that. The only reason some of you think they don't is because they don't use it in front of people who wouldn't use it.
I hope she defines herself as feminist eventually.
Ramios appears to be at a different level of development to everyone else on this thread.

Ramios, yup can deny that. Extremely easily. Quite enough reportage to anecdotally support me too. Review any news area you like. State of dress is reserved for court. At point of report it isn't. That isn't a coincidence. It's just a 'thing' trotted out to garner outdated and uneducated support. Majority of rapes are by people known to the victim. Dress is very much a last point. Not a first.

Anyone who watches basic tv drama knows this.

How many of us have our opinions maturely formed by 17? She may not consider herself a feminist now but she has certainly made a feminist stance. Give her time, I say. She does not see herself as a feminist yet.