What do you all think about male circumcision?

Oh Hecate that must be awful for you, that constant attempt to wear you down.

Oops, cross posted with Hecate, clearly it hasn't died out.

runningforthebusinheels I believe there are still some societies which practice male circumcision as a passage to manhood.

I could be wrong though, I don't know whether it's died out altogether.

I am totally opposed to it. Fiercely opposed to it.

My husband comes from a culture where it is done ritually at age 14 to mark transition to adulthood.

I refused point blank to allow it. We argued it out for a very long time. But he knew my view on it when we married and married me with that in mind. He had no right to try to change the agreement (that if we had sons they would not be circumcised) afterwards! I think he thought he could wear me down.

He tried to offer me a compromise of them having it done at birth. I refused. I said if he tried it, I'd have him deported.

I feel that strongly about it. And, like I say, he knew that from the start. From before we had a child. He had the choice to not marry me!

Now our eldest is approaching 14, he has returned to it, with some guff about them not being accepted as males in the tribe. My answer is the same. On your bike. We agreed right at the start.

As it happens, our youngest may need it done for medical reasons. He has a problem and they're monitoring him. If it needs to be done, then ok. But not for any other reason than medical need.

i don't agree with circumcision. And i don't understand what the problem is with it being posted here? That is why i don't post alot as i cannot fathom mumsnet rules?

It's assault. If you removed any other part of a baby because you thought it looked nicer, you would be locked up.

It's barbaric and as wrong as FGM.

I just hope beyond hope that people start to see that, views are changing slowly, the rates in places like the USA are going down.

Hi Zippy

Are you actively campaigning for a change of law in the UK? If you have a petition to sign or anything, I'm sure many here will sign it but you may get more traffic in another area of the board.

*Should really say I use the term FGM....

Yes, I use FGM for girls as well - the procedures are not remotely on a par.

I would ban male circumcision in a heartbeat, except for medical reasons. However, in the UK at least, the reasons for males being circumcised are predominantly religious - and as has already been said on the thread already, practised by the patriarchal religions.

I think that the word circumcision should not be used for girls. It was adopted as a way of trying to put the practices on a par. Female Genital Mutilation is the term I would use. They are by no means the same thing.

I would disagree with male circumcision in all cases, except medical necessity. Someone once posted a link on here, and I just couldn't watch it - it was horrific.

Sunnywithshowers post made me wonder though. Are there any cases of male circumcision carried out in the conditions described in her post? When the boy is on the brink of puberty, in unsanitary conditions and without anaesthesia?

Are young boys spirited away from UK schools in the summer holidays by there families and transported to countries to have this horrific procedure done to them, as in the cases of a small but significant group of UK girls?

Perhaps it's time to make this about the wimminz.

Lessthan, I think it was the opening line of the OP.

I definitely think that male circumcision is wrong. Not as wrong and disabling as FGM but still wrong.

Why is everyone being so snippy at Zippy (geddit?!). Do we have evidence to suggest that he/she has form?

FWIW IMHO Feminism is definitely about Mens Rights too. Feminism is a lovely happy thing where everyone gets a look in and is treated without prejudice. So if there's an area where men are neglected of course they should shout for their rights and I'll support them, as long as they shout for mine in return.

Although I'm not quite sure of the areas in which men have less rights than women. Probably in child custody, but that's a bit more complicated... hmm

Sorry I'm completely derailing this thread.....

I disagree with male circumcision. Full stop.

zippy Kellogg invented cereal to stop men masturbating. Is cereal a men's rights issue? There is no meaningful comparison between cicumcision and FGM. If it affects men's sexuality in any material way it would have been outlawed centuries ago.

I wonder if Zippy is American. Circumcision is so rare in Britain that most people don't think about it, and certainly there's no group except for the obvious religious ones where you could start an argument about whether it's a good thing--as shown by responses here. Whereas among Americans, it's good for a fight any day of the week.

What's more interesting is why he brought his question here, when Mumsnet has dozens of parenting-related groups to choose from, and one or two on sexual issues as well. So I'll say it again, I think he wants to get feminists talking about cocks. Other women wouldn't be as much fun for him.

The current sexist world is bad for men and for women, in different ways and to different degrees, and also in different ways and to different degrees for each individual man and woman.

Men's health issues are interesting - being "manly" in the way that society expects generally involves "not making a fuss" and I've read that a large number of male health problems are exacerbated by male reluctance to go see a doctor (because it's not many to admit that you are not strong and well).

And Dr Kellogg was a notorious fruit cake, so not a particularly useful ally for you., Zippy.

I am interested in men's issues. In men's health, for example.But MRA have views which I find unacceptable. So as a feminist, I believe it to be impossible to be both a feminist and a MRA.

Zippy I'm interested in male and female issues, and I'm a feminist.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_mutilation

"he WHO has offered four classifications of FGM. The main three are Type I, removal of the clitoral hood, almost invariably accompanied by removal of the clitoris itself (clitoridectomy); Type II, removal of the clitoris and inner labia; and Type III (infibulation), removal of all or part of the inner and outer labia, and usually the clitoris, and the fusion of the wound, leaving a small hole for the passage of urine and menstrual blood?the fused wound is opened for intercourse and childbirth.[4] Around 85 percent of women who undergo FGM experience Types I and II, and 15 percent Type III, though Type III is the most common procedure in several countries, including Sudan, Somalia, and Djibouti.[5] Several miscellaneous acts are categorized as Type IV. These range from a symbolic pricking or piercing of the clitoris or labia, to cauterization of the clitoris, cutting into the vagina to widen it (gishiri cutting), and introducing corrosive substances to tighten it.[4]"

Most, if not all, of these procedures are carried out with anaesthesia in insanitary conditions. Type III in particular can lead to infections, and infuries during sex and childbirth.

From the many men I know who were circumcised as babies. From the lack of any significant campaigning against circumcision by men who were circumcised as babies.

A lot of men actually do give a very big fuck about it Flora, where did you get that idea from? Both FGM & MGM are unacceptable.

I must admit, I wouldn't have thought the feminist board would be first port of call to discuss male circumcision and/or campaigning against it. Any more than the feminist board should be the first place to start a discussion or crusade in favour of veganism or anti-globalisation. There are lots of issues that lots of people care about, whether or not they are feminists, but the feminist board is specifically about issues which affect women.