Been out. It's not pretty out there. My feminist views are challenged tonight.

SGB raises good points. The women may not want to bother with all that dull marriage stuff and house cleaning and just want some good sex and they dress in a way that is most likely to obtain them that and which they enjoy.

I am more concerned about UK Muslim areas which are requiring women to cover up on the streets and not be public sexual beings whereas many women want sexual freedom (and may not all be out there in rich husband catching mode although that also remains a choice of women which men tend not to have.. mind you there are not that many men around who earn much more than most women so plenty of them fail to hook the meal ticket for life)

If I had a better figure I'd wear short skirts & killer heels once in a while but I'm happily married so it certainly wouldn't be to pull. I love high heels, they just make me feel the same height as everyone else so glamorous.

You could be onto something there, Abi

I think it really means "I have a right to be agreed with", Doctrrine

I have never understood what the phrase "I have a right to my opinion" means in the context of lots of people talking about their opinions.

Females seeking attention through blatant sexual exhibitionism

Oooh, were they stripping off and giving lap dances?

And is it OK for males to seek attention through blatant sexual exhibitionism?

.

I do think there are conversations to be had about sexual objectification and, in particular, pornification. But this isn't it. You are talking about fashion.

I've skipped from page 2 to page 12 to see if anyone had posted the obvious remark that some of those women probably are on the pull, and good luck to them SGB, I hope your post above wasn't the first to say so. The worryingly judgemental timbre of many posts makes me fear it might be, though.

Dummad, I find it easy to believe in your good intentions but you come over as misogynistic. You are conflating a girl's choice of going-out clothes with her morals, intelligence, politics and professional abilities. This is a little bit odd, if you think about it. If one could buy an entire personality, brain, political outlook and moral compass from Net-a-Porter, life would be fun! Seriously, clothes say all that to you? Don't be daft.

What if you saw the same crowd of youngsters at a funeral? I somehow doubt you'd have rushed on here to complain about the glum condition of Young People Today, all wearing black and looking solemn, not even flirting much

People wear whatever convention dictates they wear to a particular event. That's all. See them next year, they'll be dressed a bit differently. See them at a different pub; different again.

Actually, on re-reading you, you sound a bit like a frustrated prude. Oops, I nearly said dirty old man, sorry!

Have you already told the thread what you and your companion/s were wearing? I'd like to complete my mental picture of the gathering.

Dummad, of course you have a right to an opinion; nobody here has a gun to your head. I do think it is judgmental to make assumptions about people based on their clothes, but I'm not judging you or making assumptions about you based on your opinion. You could be running a dog foster service for victims of domestic violence for all I know.

You're also drawing massive assumptions about people's wider views based on statements they've made about clothes. I don't believe in individualism in terms of political action; concern for all women is what is required, but I don't think what you wear or don't wear really constitutes much of a political action. It is just surface clutter.

1. what is thsi bloody obsession you have with teh non existent connection between what a woman wears out with friends on a saturday night and whether she is any good at her job?

2)does anyone look at men out on a saturday night an dthink " ?Oh, how refreshing to see young men acting all liberated. I reckon he?s on for a raise come Monday morning?."? no they dont because the two situations are not connected and no-one would ever think to loof for taht connection where men are concerned so why make it an issue for women?

it was an obvious one, i couldn't let it slide!

Hardehaar! took a few seconds to work that one out! Don't we all look worse naked!

what, you mean naked?

And then after going to all that effort, many of them actually look awful and a lot worse than their more natural state.

Whatever the men wear they are more likely to be practical, comfortable and warm and have spent less time and perhaps money on their appearance. Women seem to go to extremes to do the opposite. Isn't a surprise men might think some women come across as more frivolous, different priorities, not to be taken as serious and out to attract attention.

Agree the look of the moment tends to veer towards transvestite (ha, like that one), glamour model, porn star rather then prostitute.

kim from experience i can tell you that men have as much variation in their dress style than women whether they are on the pull or not.

different men have different styles. some wil wear a shirt and trousers. some jeans and a t-shirt, some shorts and a muscle vest. depends again, what type of place you're in.

I agree with SGB that women may be out looking for casual sex, and some will want male sexual attention and to pay sexual attention to men, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that whatsoever. But I also think you usually can't tell that from somebody's clothing.

exactly lapsed

SBG i agree. all these posters hoiking judgy pants up in horror at a women dressed as if she is only after one thing might like to consider the idea that she is indeed after only one thing and there is nothing at all wrong with a woman going out with the intention of finding someone to have a ONS with.

But most of the women who wear revealing clothes in bars and clubs at the weekend don't wear clothes like that to go round the supermarket, walk their dogs or go to work. Dressing in clothes that are 'sexy' according to current mainstream culture may be actively saying 'I want some NSA sex tonight.'
I see some posters fainting with horror at the idea of casual sex and implying that this is the terrible fate that awaits women who dress in revealing clothes - but they are missing the point that sometimes a woman wants casual sex. And this is a good thing (though not, obviously, something people should do when they really don't like the idea). The more young women engage in casual sex because they are horny, and too busy with their lives to want to 'settle down' with a man, the better: the insistence that women have to have 'love' to enjoy sex means too many women put up with men who are crap in bed and crap at being partners, because they believe that having 'let' the man have sex with them, they now have to maintain a relationship with him even though he's not up to much.

I would say the hyper-feminine Towie/Geordie Shore look owes far more to conventions of transvestite entertainment than actual (as opposed to fantasy) prostitution. It's an absurd exaggeration of what women are 'supposed' to look like and is 99% fake - hair, skin (dyed) lashes, nails, tits etc etc. Working girls on the street dress for comfort and have to be able to scarper/defend themselves at short notice.

I think a lot of posters on MN do not understand the most common sexual 'services' performed by prostitues that they are likely to fail to see on the streets.

SSS, some women who dress in that highly groomed but covered up 'classy' way do it for male approval or attention and others do not. You simply cannot assume all women have the same intentions as yourself in life. Is it really that difficult to talk to other women rather than make assumptions about them?

As for biological urges, it's fairly easy to get them met whatever you're wearing. Prostitutes tend to wear casual clothes - jeans, tshirts etc, so I've no idea how you think that spills over into clubwear.

"And for posters who get all prickly when prostitutes are mentioned, the way a sex worker dresses hasn't changed all that remarkably over the decades."

did you see my earlier post? have you met any prostitutes in RL?

Obviously they dress within their class and group in a way that attracts men. Now that may be with more or less covered depending on your grouping (and if it's your Alpha bible class in London it may be a skirt to the floor) but whatever your grouping young girls that age choose to play the game to attract a man in the main. I would rather mumsnet campaigned to support one proposed legal change - public nudity than repression and censorship which tends to be its usual supported cause.