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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

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Original poster

Chat thread - come chat, rant, or celebrate, here!

433 replies

LRDtheFeministDragon · 23/01/2013 22:48

With thanks to the lovely timetosmile - here's the new and rejuvenated Chat Thread.

Space to yak on, rant, post any of the good and bad stuff ... just basically any chat that you don't feel fits into a specific post. With a side order of reclaiming the word 'gossip'.

OP posts:

DaffodilAdams · 15/04/2013 19:45

LordCopper I got Laura Marlin (Lauren St John) for my nephew's 9th birthday and he asked for another one for his 10th. I haven't read them but they have a girl detective as a central character which I thought might be a nice change. His mum seems to like them too.

UptoapointLordCopper · 15/04/2013 19:09

Tomorrow's Woman's Hour on why so few female mathematics professors.

Original poster

LRDtheFeministDragon · 15/04/2013 17:22

The Stone Book is (IMO) very sweet and not scary. I agree the Weirdstone is scary!

I agree about Magicians - it is lovely and kind. But beautifully non-preachy. As a dyslexic her idea of children who don't do magic well struck a chord with me.

I'm wondering if the Boston books would be in the library ... they only came back into print quite recently, it's daft to recommend I suppose. I'll see if they're in my local bookshop.

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UptoapointLordCopper · 15/04/2013 17:15

I love the Magicians of Caprona. Such a kind book, I thought.

I read the Weirdstone book - the relationship between the siblings are good, but it might be too scary.

I'll check out the Lucy M Boston books too next time. We have maxed out all our library cards now...

Original poster

LRDtheFeministDragon · 15/04/2013 17:04

Lucky?! Lucy.

God almighty, that gave you the wrong impression, sorry!

OP posts:

Original poster

LRDtheFeministDragon · 15/04/2013 17:03

Oh, but that's a great age, there's so much out there to buy for us them!

Theresa Thomlinson probably more like 9 (or older, but I was dead sheltered!) than 7. What is lovely is the Children of Green Knowe by Lucky M Boston. It does have a male main character, but two wonderful strong female characers too, and it is a lovely book. If they like that, Chimneys of Green Knowe has a main female character.

(Maybe you know these, sorry! I just get giddy about books as I love them!).

Alan Garner's books are great too, IMO, but lots are for older ages.

Do you know Wynne Jones's Magicians of Caprona? I love that so much. I think the thing I like best is that it re-tells a Romeo and Juliet story, but does it so as to present boys being friends with girls as normal. I think that's great. Cos I was thinking, of the books we're talking about, you don't get many boy-girl friend pairs, do you? Siblings, yes, but not often friends.

Same in grown up books, I suppose.

OP posts:

UptoapointLordCopper · 15/04/2013 17:00

DS1 has just got into the Harry Potter books. DS2 is unpredictable - tried to like the books but I think his heart's not in it. DS1 has plans to read the Hobbit after Harry Potter but I have plans to divert him to Diana Wynne Jones. But they are readers and will pick what they fancy and there is no telling ...

UptoapointLordCopper · 15/04/2013 16:52

9 and 7. Proper menaces. I have started reading the preteen board. >

Original poster

LRDtheFeministDragon · 15/04/2013 16:43

Oh, yeah? Entirely altruistic, is it?

I love children's books, I need no excuse to read them. I agree Ursula le Guin is fantastic. Diana Wynne Jones too - and my impression with her is that she wrote a lot for her sons, as she wrote more female characters when they were older (one of her sons was a lecturer of mine). I totally agree with you about the way she observes - so brilliant. I love her books.

How old are your boys?

OP posts:

UptoapointLordCopper · 15/04/2013 16:34

My excuse of reading all these books is to find suitable reading material for DSs. They like books but are easily scared.

UptoapointLordCopper · 15/04/2013 16:33

Oh yes, she was Miss Greythorne. So she does have a name. I apologise.

The Earthsea books - Ursula Le Guin started off as having a single male hero but towards the end it becomes more and more feminist. That is really interesting as well.

Diana Wynne Jones has mostly male main characters, but some of her female characters are very interesting, and they interact and are people. But I like her mainly because she observed and seemed to be kind and seemed to understand. Like in Howls' moving castle (which I thought was the best thing ever when I read it last year - so observant), the Pinhoe Egg, and the Dark Lord of Derkholm - just the few that struck me more than others.

Original poster

LRDtheFeministDragon · 15/04/2013 16:04

Mmm, yes, that's true about female monarchs/PMs! She was Miss Greythorne IIRC (maybe I am confusing that with the MNer). And I do think names are odd in those books, with Merriman and so on. But on balance I agree.

Please don't stop taking these things too seriously! I love chatting about books and stuff like this. It's the things that float into your head, isn't it, and it is interesting. Because I think children's books are so influential, even when you don't realize at the time. Rosemary Sutcliffe and Cynthia Harnett are other authors I absolutely love, but who write male characters as heroes almost every time.

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UptoapointLordCopper · 15/04/2013 15:57

I don't know about Theresa Thomlinson's books but will look them up next time in the library.

The thing about the Lady reminds me of the same phenomenon as having a female monarch/female prime minister (once upon a time ) while women in general were/are not having such a good time. JS Mill mentioned it too but can't remember what he said. And the Lady had no name. A symbol/enbodiment rather than a person? I still enjoyed the book though...

Should stop taking these things too seriously? Maybe? Maybe not?

Original poster

LRDtheFeministDragon · 15/04/2013 15:52

Oh, I love The Dark is Rising!

You are completely right. I've tried not to notice it, but ... you are right. I think I don't notice because my favourite of the series is The Dark is Rising itself, where at least the Lady plays a reasonably important role, and Hawkin balances out the other men. I don't like so much the ones with the other children.

Do you know Theresa Thomlinson's books? Now she is good for the same age range but with strong female characters.

OP posts:

UptoapointLordCopper · 15/04/2013 15:29

The first one (under stone over sea or something like that) just had the "standard" pooh-poohing of your sister's opinions. I did enjoy the story a lot though. Quite scary, I thought. (Just about my threshold of scariness. I had nightmares for months and months, if not years, after watching the sixth sense. )

TheDoctrineOfSnatch · 13/04/2013 08:23

Wah, I have good fuzzy memories of The Dark is Rising but it sounds like a reread would be a mistake.

UptoapointLordCopper · 08/04/2013 12:26

Hello!

Been on holiday. :)

Read Susan Cooper's The Dark is Rising and was surprised at how unfeminist it is - heroes and great villains are male, women are either the nasty little witch or victims or unnamed even if they are supposed to be powerful.

On the other hand I also read the first chapter of The Subjection of Women. Slightly shocked at the vehemence. He talked about the raising of girls as slaves who want to please their future masters... OK so it was Victorian. But does it still apply now to any extend?

Yes, that's what I do on holiday ...

TeiTetua · 05/04/2013 15:50

That makes me think of an incident that a family friend told me, from when he was a civil servant who worked for a fairly high-up government official. His boss had young children, and one day the boss told him about an incident that happened at home. The kid asked,

"Daddy, have you got an important job?"
"Yes, I think it's an important job. Everyone says so."
"Is it the MOST important job?"
"Well, no. Mrs Thatcher has the MOST important job."
"Oh, in that case--is it the most important MAN's job?"

Laugh? Cry?

TheDoctrineOfSnatch · 05/04/2013 13:03

Was just on the phone to my boss. DS1 asked, "Is your boss a girl?" I said,"No, he's a boy." He then asked, "Do you have another boss who's a girl?"

This makes me happy.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch · 05/04/2013 07:13

AIBU to think the phrase "and she's a mum" should be banned and work and replaced with "and he/she wants to have some family time"?

SatsukiKusukabe · 02/04/2013 22:51

only half

TheDoctrineOfSnatch · 02/04/2013 22:46

I know, great pay and perks, what's not to clamour for? apart from the undying loathing of half the country

SatsukiKusukabe · 02/04/2013 21:25

that email! freshman are 18, they should already be trying to bag a man? and at 22 they are already left on the shelf?

UptoapointLordCopper · 02/04/2013 16:55

These pesky women. Next thing you know they'd want some respect too.

I got John Stuart Mill's the subjection of women yesterday. May read it on holiday and lose whatever sense of humour I've ever had. I read Tami Hoeg's Still Waters recently - has anyone read that? Don't. I've forgotten how awful these Mills-and-Boons type things are. Man bully woman, but all is forgiven because they found each other oh-so-irresistible. Bleurgh.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch · 02/04/2013 16:12

Just got an email entitled, "Women are still clamouring to be bankers"

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