Random men speaking to you

Is that because they tend not to back down and 'disarm' situations as well as women?...

It also true that men are more than three times likely to be killed, five times likely to be maimed and ten times more likely to be attacked than women.

Well, I was going to put a caveat in saying that logically we know women are statistically in far more danger in their own homes than they are on the street at twilight, but I didn't.

I guess I should have.

I cross the street if walking behind someone....its sad really that I feel I need to.

Walking towards someone face to face doesn't seem to cause such anxiety??

who do you think did the service to the 12-13 year old in that story?

The man who had read stories and saw her as threatened?
The girl who had read the same stories and was scared out of her wits
the people who had written and perpetuated the stories of women being under threat all the time?

Yeah, that's sort of what I was alluding to garlic - which means it's even more about power, control, entitlement, etc, etc, ad nauseum.

My Dad tells a story that was a bit of an eye-opener for him. He was walking home from work one evening when he spotted our neighbour's daughter about 50 metres ahead of him, also walking home. She'd have been aged maybe about 12 or 13 at the time. It was twilight, so getting dark. Far enough away for her not to know who the person was behind her.

He instinctively sped up to overtake her, because he assumed she'd be scared of the man 'following' her. He's 6'3". The more he sped up, the more she did too, looking over her shoulder. He suddenly realised she must've thought he was trying to catch up to her and was more scared because of that. He was trying to help the situation, but was making it worse. He stopped and waited until she'd gone before continuing. He says it was a real eye-opener as to a situation he would take for granted, but that must be quite fraught for the majority of women.

Completely agree...I have said some very silly things when presented with a pretty face at the last moment. Its a development from pulling pigtails...

NO!

I can never understand not being happy/able to walk where I want at night.....but I can see the hesitation in others faces when they are presented with a large stranger.

By the way the 'short man' and the 'incessantly talking back' syndrome are all expressions of fear - a hard man knows (according to my embarrassing internet research that when a guy says 'yeah who are you' or keeps arguing beyond reason he is basically saying 'shiiiit I'm SCARED but if I keep talking you will think I'm not' Short guys in fight mode surounded by tall women they can't hit and big bouncers are more scared - hence more back chat and argument - a good bouncer will look away, step back and give space and smile.. but not in a patronising 'laugh at the hobbit' way. the trick is to look subservient to the rage.

Of course if someone is in a 'small stature small dick' rage then he needs to feel pain or inflict pain before he stops. It only takes a slap you know! :)

Hey! You know that men are daft brutish and crap at conversation don't you (well a lot of men) couldn't it be that some men who like open emotional conversation are just seeking a connection and women are better at giving it?

LOL Peterpan101

Are you being obtuse ?

If you are a big man then you certainly are not putting SomersetONeil at ease.

Just skipping from the original post with a belly full of wine....

I like saying "good morning" (and other such trivia) to complete strangers in secluded situations/late at night (i am a big man and like to put people at ease)...

This has embarrassed ex partners in the past with a: "why did you say that/do you know them" comment.....

I hope Ive not offended!!??

This is why so many women play along and be polite even when they're secretly thinking the man is a buffoon - because of our own personal safety. It just is not worth escalating a situation because we know we'd come off worse.

I've never thought about this before - and it might be a purely personal hangover from childhood - but I've always been more confident "talking down" a big, aggressive man than a smaller one. During one of the less sophisticated periods of my youth, I was the bouncer at a very rough nightclub. I could charm knives and guns off the local gangsters, but would instinctively enlist a big guy to help me with a stroppy little man.

Massive generalisation warning ...

Do you think this is why small men are often more obnoxious to women? I wonder if they see it (even unconsciously) as an opportunity to be the dominator for a change.

My dad was an appalling sexist bully; he was short. I'm not talking about him in particular, just men I've worked with and encountered socially, but my perception might be coloured by him; I'm not sure.

One of the best things about being my age is how much more effective my hard stare is now

I didn't say that they don't have to consider it at all though, did I? I specifically said they don't have to consider it in their exchanges with the opposite sex. Which is what this is being dismissed as by people who can't see the problem...

In any case, if some men are able to empathise with the situation, then it's even more odd that they would carry on doing it...

I agree with most of what you say.
But you are wrong in saying men dont even have to consider it.
They may not with women, but they certainly do with men.

In fact, they consider it a great deal.
Smaller men, are, on the whole, scared of bigger men.
And , I would say, scared, on probably a daily level.

Men also, very simply, have physical power. Most men are bigger than most women. And that is anxiety-causing on a very basic level. Especially when you're outnumbered.

I'm 5'9" so not exactly small. In fact, I'm often one of the tallest people in any given group. But I still feel intimidated in a situation that has my hackles and spider senses rising. How much worse must it be for smaller women?

This is something I try to reiterate on these types of threads. Most men simply don't know what it feels like to default be the physically weaker person in such a situation. It's a huge disadvantage. It's downright scary a lot of the time.

This is why so many women play along and be polite even when they're secretly thinking the man is a buffoon - because of our own personal safety. It just is not worth escalating a situation because we know we'd come off worse.

This //\ is where privileged and entitlement come in to play. Men don't even have to consider this in their exchanges with the opposite sex. Women have to consider it all the time. One man's off-the-cuff exchange is another woman's discomfort and anxiety. Nice...

Actually , thinking about it, it could have been flirting.

Xenia, you have posted before on MN that you use flattery.

namech, we don't make it up. I showed a plumber a couple of years ago whilst I was up a ladder where the tank was and for some reason he had to put both hands on my sides.

I agree that builders etc are more blatant but it happens in offices with men earning £200k - £1m a year. I had an ex MP at the end of a business meeting ask me if I wanted sex. Where he thought we were going to do it considering my son was in the house and I would not fancy him in a month of Sundays I do not know.

Builders are subject to employment policies these days such as not to wool whistle on sites and they are much better than they were. Most employees have sex harrassment guidelines at work. It is much better than it used to be but it has certainly not disappeared. In a sense the more women put up with it the more men think it's fine or don't even notice that what they've done is wrong or objectionable.

Perhaps all women on this thread tomorrow should do two tasks - if they meet a man who isn't smiling day "give us a smile" and if they see a man who looks fit whistle at him... I suspect most of us would not really want to. If someone is looking you and down in that way you can certainly reciprocate and look them up and down as if they are fresh male meat you have the right to take I suppose although that might not be safe.

i do talk to random women in the street, on the bus etc,

Namechangeguy boundaries aren't set in stone are they.

I had a builder in my house the other day. A friend of a friend. He was talking to me about some potential work and 3 times he touched me on the arm.

At work, if my boss or colleagues touch me on the arm, I don't mind - don't even notice probably, it's not sexual, it's not threatening, it's ... nothing really, just someone touching me. Not even worth noticing. In a supermarket, someone might touch my back while guiding me towards an aisle and I prob wouldn't mind.

Sth about this guy creeped me out though. Something to do with him being in my house alone with me and not knowing me (first time we'd ever chatted) and overstepping those physical boundaries. He may just be tactile, but so what? The fact that I didn't respond positively the first time, should have stopped him the second time but the fact that he went on to do it the third time, made me decide that there's no way I'm hiring him or having him in my house ever again. I doubt if he'd have touched a man in that way, however tactile he may be.

And yet at work, if someone touched me four times, I wouldn't notice, much less be offended.

So my boundaries differ according to the person, context and situation I'm in. And how tactile someone is, how friendly, how pushy etc., in a normal person also differ according to their context.

The context with men and women, is that men as a group have power over women as a group. The power to rape and call it consensual sex and usually be believed, the power to operate within social norms which have been written and defined by men, the power to take for granted that their perception of an event, is the correct one because that's what movies, TV, books, shows etc. tell us all.

Smiling at people is ingratiating yourself, like a dog rolling over in submission?
I smile at people if they smile at me as a matter of courtesy. It would be rude not to. male or female.

If you watch videos or pay for training on how to show your power there are all kinds of things you can do whatever your gender from taking up space in the room, not deferring to others, not touching your hair, not smiling all the time etc. It is certainly something you can be trained in if you want to bother.

Wow, I'm agreeing with Xenia on this thread!

Social smiling is the human equivalent of a dog rolling over to expose its belly to a more powerful dog.

I'm aware I smile ingratiatingly too much when nervous- it's a habit I'm trying to kick.