Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

maninism/mens rights!!

310 replies

jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 00:12

why are good loving fathers not given equal rights, why are we forced to spend thousands and go through lengthy court battles for the right to be a father to our own children all because the mother is so selfish and self centered that she can decide to do this with no regard for her childs happiness and future well-being just because she can out of spite and nastiness towards her ex partner. Many thousands of men have not been allowed to see or speak to their children for weeks or years and many simply cannot afford to continue their legal pursuit and are forced to give up for this exact reason. And yet these women have the audacity to call them themselves mothers, its laughable they are barely human beings.
Fathers are EQUALY important as mothers yet the law and some women's attitudes do not seem to reflect this. I know of a man who did everything he could to be part of his childs life, paid 36,000 in csa payments and was forced to have little contact with that child,then 10 years after she was born, rumours came out that that child wasnt his, a dna test confirmed this! Her motive? GREED, it is an all to common story, so many "mums" do not even consider how keeping their childs father out of their lives affects them in the the short and long term without even mentioning its moraly wrong. Any mum who takes there children away from there dad. doesn't deserve the bloody title! OUR children is the only way you can hurt us, which is why you use them as weapons and pawns in your sick twisted games, so how about you grow up realise life is too short, and that your children's happiness is actually MORE IMPORTANT THAN YOUR OWN! you may have your children now when they are young but i promise you you'll lose them when they learn the truth they will NEVER forgive you for destroying their special relationship with their dad and ensuring they had a s**t childhood, and let that be on your conscience,not that you have one or a soul or a heart or brain.
So stop punishing your children let their dads have access to them as much as you do, that is called EQUALITY.
this rant is aimed at all the dead beat"mums", i realise and recognise that the majority of mums are amazing and do the right thing by their kids by letting their father play a prominent role in their lives, as it should be. And obviously not all dads are worthy of that title either but i'm not talking about them i have as much respect for them as i do for these women that my comments are directed at.
Il be here waiting for your comments i felt it necessary to voice these facts in the lion's den so to speak, we need to be heard, fathers NEED equal rights.

OP posts:
rosabud · 21/10/2012 09:21

Thankyou for your observations on my post and for drawing the conclusion that I am like you and that my ex is an arsehole.Neither observations are true. Though there are many things that my ex has done which make me less than sympathetic to him, he does have regular contact with our children. However, should he ever behave like you have done on a public forum and display that kind of rudeness, intolerance, anger and abuse to others, then there is no court in the land that could make me let my children go anywhere near him.

Is this how you behave in real life? Are you this angry and abusive in daily situations? Were you this angry/ illogical/ abusive to your ex? Then I completely understand her reluctance to let you anywhere near a baby.

PlentyOfPubeGardens · 21/10/2012 07:01

Is this how you spoke to your ex?

Strawhatpirate · 21/10/2012 05:14

I'm not sure how we can help you Jiveturkey you seem very angry indeed. Why not get some sleep and come back later? And then if you have any specific questions about feminism and the legal system we can help you out? Because I really don't think this is a very productive discusion. Surely we can't answer for our entire gender. Consider instead perhaps that it was only in the 2nd half of the 20th century that women had any rights to their children at all. If a marraige broke down the father would get the children automaticaly.

sashh · 21/10/2012 05:06

why would i want to get married firstt i believe in science and facts not god this is 2012 not the 60's where peopl were very religous

Because it automatically gives you parental rights. I know a couple who got married for this very reason.

And how is sayiing you could be the perfect partner, "disgusting accusations"? Do you think FUCK YOU YOU STUCK UP CNT!* is a nice thing to say?

And you then consider yourself able to comment on my mental health, and that my only opinions are because of a previous relationship with a man - how bloody dare you?

You do not know me.
You do not know what relationships I have had or not had.
You don't even know if I'm a woman.

Oh and it's you're not your.

jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 04:57

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 04:55

like i said i haven't had the chance with everyone attacking me, and if you dont know the whole story why the fuck make disgusting accusations, your not right in the mind, just because your woman i dont automatically say oh shes a woman she must nag because that is a disgusting generalisation as is what you said, why dont you try thinking before you speak and learning all the facts! if your american i apologise you cant help it!

OP posts:
jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 04:52

like i said i haven't had the chance with everyone attacking me, and if you dont know the whole story why the fuck make disgusting accusations, your not right in the mind, just because your woman i dont automatically say oh shes a woman she must nag because that is a disgusting generalisation as is what you said, why dont you try thinking before you speak and learning all the facts! if your american i apologise you cant help it!

OP posts:
sashh · 21/10/2012 04:44

I'm not angry, I just want to know the whole story. As I said you could be the perfect partner but you have not given any back story.

jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 04:23

i posted it in femininism because femininism is about equal rights, and hey! guess what my post is about equal rights, now are there any other thick people with stupid things to say or is that it, please come back peanut and casey you seem to be the only two women that had something constructive to say!!

OP posts:
jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 04:17

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 04:07

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 03:54

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

sashh · 21/10/2012 03:52

i would spend most of my wages every week on my son if i was allowed to be his dad but i haven't seen or heard if he's well or sick for 8 months not even a pic, yet iam forced to fund "terroism" of my son by funding their life

He is still your son.
He still costs money.
You are a father, babies cost money - do you expect the taxpayer to pay for your child?

You could have reregistered your child to include you. Or you could have gone with your ex to register the birth - why didn't you?

What is this 'terrorism'?

this IS NOT about men vs women THIS IS ABOUT WHAT IS RIGHT FOR OUR CHILDREN

Then why post in feminism?

How can we possibly know what is right for your child? All you have said is that your ex left taking your son. You have not said why she left, if you had any idea she would leave, where she has gone, basically any facts.

You come accross as a spoilt 5 year old. You are equally responsible for your child. If you wanted parental responsibility there is a lot you could have done, such as not have a child to a woman you are not married to.

You may be the most fantastic father and partner, you way have beaten your partner and 1 month old - there is no way for us to tell.

jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 03:46

thankyou casey thats exactly what i was after, we got there in the end lol. i completely agree with every single word you said!
true words of wisdom right there, now if only politicians would act on it!

solidgoldbrass i see i silenced your pathetic comments, no come back to that one eh? maybe you'll grow up now remember lifes to short.
il leave you all with this quote from a legal website
"According to the law, child abuse is ANY injury to a child's life or health. There is no doubt that parental alienation is child abuse, as it emotionally scars the child for life, and there is no doubt that those who participate in it or condone it are guilty of criminal child abuse. There are no advantages for a child to have its parents separated, or if separated, not to have free access to both, but children get older, and with time question the mothers behaviour."
once again thanks to casey and peanut for your intelligent, constructive comments, wish i could say the same about the others.

OP posts:
ConsiderCasey · 21/10/2012 03:05

Grin jiveturkey. At the end of the day the decent people are on the same side. A child can never have too many loving adults in their life.

Personally yes I'd welcome a change in the law, a principle of 50:50 during the marriage and after. I think that provides the best continuity for the child. I think that if couples went into a relationship knowing that's how it's going to be, they would accept it and strive to maintain an egalitarian relationship. It would help women to continue their careers after a divorce and men to maintain a loving relationship with their kids. After the initial acrimony has settled down parents will have to get on with it.

In cases where one parent has done the lion's share of the childcare this should be recognised as that person will have given up their wage earning potential so some form of recompense is needed for that. A situation of resident parent with definite access rights for the non-resident parent. As the child gets older the situation can change and a more equitable arrangement made.

Of course all that would be vetoed in cases of domestic abuse as I don't think any child should have to witness violence as that's very damaging.

As for the cases of absent parents who neither want to pay or visit, that's a tough one because i think it's unwise to force a child upon a parent who has no interest in them, it could damage their self-esteem and I'm not sure how to make those absent parents pay. That is a dilemma and can lead to a lot of anger putting the resident parent into a frightening situation.

But to me that seems the fairest arrangement.

Now I must go to bed! Let us know how your court case goes.

jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 02:48

rosabud so why is that an excuse to put all fathers in the same useless arsehole category im tired im pissed of iv not seen my son in 8 months but i didnt generalise because its simply not true and hurtfull to us good mothers and fathers.
my post maybe vile but its 100% true. im sorry to hear your ex falls into the arsehole category, and your kids are very lucky to have such a supportive supermum, i hope he pays you maintenance and supports you as much as he can! and i apologise for saying you talk from your arsehole you clearly dont your just like me

OP posts:
rosabud · 21/10/2012 02:41

Thankyou for that rather vile observation, personally I feel working very late into a Saturday evening to keep life and soul together for 4 children is a fairly real life experience whereas ranting and raging on the internet about having to support your baby is a bit, well, pathetic really. Goodnight.

jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 02:38

i didn't mean it to be accusatory for that i apologise i have a lot a anger about missing so much of my sons first year, im not a public speaker im a young bloke writing this on his playstation and iv got questions coming at me from all angles iam trying to be polite to those who are polite to me, my thumbs are getting tired now. i didnt mean to come across as rude or obtuse and for that i apologise also i just really want to know what you guys think about this and whether father's should have equal rights, iv never done a post bfore so firgive roughness. and casey i think i will become a feminist we should all have equal rights in every aspect of life there should be NO exceptions

OP posts:
jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 02:27

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

ConsiderCasey · 21/10/2012 02:22

I'm not sure what to say. If people are being defensive it is because your OP was extremely accusatory. The school playground atmosphere was set by yourself. Maybe you should read it again.

Having said that I understand you are coming from a place of intense pain So yes, the law is being unfair to you. Like I said many times feminists welcome hands-on fathers. Unfortunately people don't tend to focus on that aspect of feminism.

Aspiemum2 · 21/10/2012 02:22

Is it possible that the tone of your posts is not helping?

It does come across a bit as an attack and could be interpreted as quite hostile.

Perhaps if you approached it as a more reasoned debate then you would get more constructive replies?

From a personal perspective it is coming across to me as a bit of a wild rant, which is fine if that is what you need but then start with that. Just say your pissed off and need to vent, that I would get!

rosabud · 21/10/2012 02:12

I agree my post is vile, but so was the OP's original one and it's late and I've been working late into the night on a Saturday evening in order to suport my 4 children abandoned by idiot ex who is jolly cross and angry every time the whole world doesn't immediately fall into place for him so, you know, patience kind of thin and all that.

jiveturkey · 21/10/2012 02:09

iam not calling on anyone to take responsibility, iam bringing this situation to your attention as human beings. as i said in my op this rant is aimed at all the dead beat"mums", i realise and recognise that the majority of mums are amazing and do the right thing by their kids by letting their father play a prominent role in their lives, as it should be. so bare that in mind mind when you accuse me of hypocrasy and generalising. iam not attacking any of you personally, as i know and understand that only a minority of women commit parental alienation, as i also mentioned in my op so please stop being defensive so we can all discuss this issue as human beings not women and man i.e me.
i didnt come here to have a pop at women i came to see what your opinions were on this issue
and currently iam unimpressed, apart from peanut and 1 or two others iv read no constructive comments just aload of defensive crap, im here because im interested in your opinion im trying my best so hows about you share your experiences and knowledge like im attempting to do cos at the moment i feel like im in a school playground!
thank you to those with useful things to say i appreciate it.

OP posts:
solidgoldbrass · 21/10/2012 02:04

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

peanutMD · 21/10/2012 02:00

Rosabud your post is vile.

It's not that easy, one of my best friends has been fighting to see their 2 children who have been estranged since the age of 1/2 and are now 12/13. The other parent upped and left with the children and has been making things incredibly difficult ever since by moving/blocking contact/poisoning children against the estranged parent.

Oh and fwiw the estranged parent in this case is a female who suffered from PND (not in anyway a danger to the children) after having 2 children very close together aged 17 with a 'reputable' older man who was abusive behind closed doors.

The thought of anyone being smug and satisfied about a child missing out on a parent disgusts me.

Swipe left for the next trending thread