Violence Against Women

eats, go and look up what a 'social system' is.

You don't understand the term.

Women are both part of a patriarchial society, and oppressed by it. As has been explained many times.

If you disagree, you can explain why.

But you asked the question; you've been given the answers, and it's rude to simply deny them.

I am not asking you for personal information - as I have said - but I did ask you for academic references, not from blogs. The fact you couldn't provide them and the fact you linked to a blog apparently ignorant of the kind of academic text it was discussing make it quite obvious you are not a medical expert.

I don't want to know anything personal about you, but I do feel that if you are going to tell someone you are an expert in an area of discussion as fraught as gender reassignment surgery, you need to be telling the truth. I do not believe you were. I don't think it was a deliberate lie, I think you simply said something over-ambitious in the heat of the moment, because you wanted to be right.

That's understandable, but it's not ok to keep on with it.

Forgive me for C&P from another thread, but you seem still to believe that 'we are not all part of the patriarchy. How do you think women are part of the patriarchy? I am genuinely puzzled that you think that.'

I can understand you being puzzled. I can understand you needing to ask simple questions.

But, when you do, and people suggest they think you're not following the answers, it is rude to come back and insist you know what you're talking about and agree with them. Given that you are the one who is puzzled and questioning, you are better off trying to learn.

Women are part of the patriarchy because the patriarchy is a social system.

I explained this very early on the other thread, and if you'd used the wiki link I gave you, you could have looked it up on there.

I am not going to spend more time here - I can see you may want to, but you'll be much better off stopping, thinking about what's been explained in answer to your questions, and trying to follow it.

You are not reading words, or you are not understanding them.

Please stop pretending we 'agree'.

If we 'agreed', you would understand that no-one - men, women, small annoying children - lives outside the patriarchy. We are all part of the patriarchy. That is what 'social system' means.

Do you follow?

And, when are you going to retract your claims to be a medical expert? It is a concern that someone might read this thread and believe you, without seeing that you are not one.

It is fine to be at the stage of needing to ask exceedingly simple questions about feminism, but do you understand that when you do that, you're asking people to help you out with learning? And people will be willing to do that - but not if you twist what is said or make claims you cannot support. It's not fair and it does get people's backs up.

You need to understand basic feminism before you can understand specialized applications.

As has been explained to you many times - patriarchy refers to a system of social oppression, wherein men as a class oppress women as a class.

I linked you to wikipedia before. I think you're probably still needing to read and understand that.

If you are still unclear about whether or not men are part of the patriarchy, I think you are still not understanding how the term is defined in a feminist context.

If you just google 'feminism patriarchy definitions', or similar, you'll come up with loads of different versions and you'll get to see what the state of the debate is.

No, you're wrong.

I'm not going to debate this again on a separate thread.

I've explained on several threads, and I've answered your questions as carefully as I knew how.

Your thread on patriarchy, where it became apparent you don't know that the standard usage of the term and the use of the term in the context of feminism are different, is an example.

I have no problem with people wanting to ask questions and share knowledge. Loads of lovely posters have done the same for me. There's no need to feel as if you've got to put on a front.

Yes, but there is no explanation of that, or if these photos were taken mid way through treatment, or at the end of treatment.

And how should the reader know whether these were photos of people happy with the treatment or not?

Where is the rest of the story? And what about those who have gone through this treatment and the results have been good?

I didn't look at the link yesterday, because I was on iPhone and couldn't open it. I did today.

I don't see what that blog adds to the discussion at all, Eats.

As I said earlier, I don't have a lot of knowledge about this, and that blog did absolutely nothing to inform me further.

Surgery of any kind is going to be a bit gruesome, but posting pics without any explanation, ie. who the person is, if he is happy with the results, how the acceptance in his family and workplace has been etc ... I don't see how it furthers understanding of the issues.

Eats, if you really do need to post and run as you often claim, it would be courteous to make your first post more of a full statement. For example:

"I think not enough is being done to find non-surgical solutions to gender dysphoria. I read this blog Xx that had graphic images showing that even after surgery many FTM transsexuals were unhappy with the results. Do other posters think more counselling/more support groups/more hormone treatment could improve matters?"

It really wouldn't take much longer to type and would mean people could see your point without having to try and access broken links, see things they weren't expecting to and above all decide whether to engage based on some idea of what you are talking about.

You're probably right, ala.

Eats, if you want to learn, there is a poster on here who works with trans teenagers, maybe read her posts on the matter. She IS an expert.

Exactly AnyF It is like me saying I can count to 50 in spanish and anyone who tells me I can't speak spanish fluently is wrong because I can use google to translate the other words I don't understand. Just because I can count to 50 in spanish does not make me bilingual!