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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Giving DCs different surnames?

35 replies

somuchforanindiansummer · 19/09/2012 14:09

I am posting this in FWR as I am looking for thoughts and input from like minded folk. I understand that this topic is frequented by MNers from right across the feminist spectrum (IYSWIM!) and threads can often turn into a bunfight about whether or not we are talking a load of shite. However, I really am looking for constructive input, so while contributions from anyone are welcome, I don't want to simply be told I am being ridiculous or any such thing without any helpful comments.

So, DP & I have a DS. If we do ever get married I would not change my surname. When I was pregnant with DS I was adamant that we come up with a fair way of deciding whose surname he got, as there was no way he was going to automatically get DP's. So we went with boy gets his/girl gets mine, which was fine with both of us except I lost Grin . Now I am pregnant with DC2 and am thinking about surnames again. Again, I see no logical reason why s/he should automatically get DP's, but somehow it doesn't seem so easy to be adamant about it this time, as for him/her to have my surname would mean 2 kids with 2 different surnames. I am a great believer in what kids grow up with is normal for them, but equally, I don't of course want to single them out for a hard life.

Feedback so far from the topic coming up in conversation - and my response to it - includes:

"But how will they know they're siblings if they have different surnames?" - Err, we'll tell them...
"But it'd be confusing for them" - Really? Kids seem to cope with having different first names without too much confusion (and as I said, I do think kids can be far more accepting of the unusual than adults sometimes)
"But people will think they've got different fathers" - So the fuck what?

So while I have no problem digging my heels in and challenging norms when I feel it is needed, part of me wonders if it would be putting my feminist stubbornness above the interest of my kids. I can't decide if this is edging over into too-contrary-even-for-me territory... Confused So I would be interested in others' thoughts, opinions & inputs on this - I'm not very good at 'picking my battles' - so help me decide whether this one is worth the trouble!

OP posts:
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samandi · 02/10/2012 22:32

Ah ok. Well then, no I can't see a problem giving them different names.

hzgreen · 02/10/2012 16:37

In my case because the names sound stupid together.

samandi · 02/10/2012 12:22

Why not just give both kids both surnames?

catsrus · 30/09/2012 10:40

We agreed to do this (over 20 yrs ago), girls mine, boys (nowex)dhs, then we had all girls and so they all had mine.

It really has caused no confusion at all - they are all adults now and simply explain to anyone who realises their father has a different name (and asks) that that was the decision their parents made. One dd talked about changing hers to her dads when she started secondary school but decided against it (now says she's glad she has myname not hisname). I think it's a good thing to make them aware that there is a choice in naming children and a choice about what they call themselves should they every marry.

The relatives on his side were a bit Confused but soon got used to it his dad was OK once he realised any boys would be "hisname" - ironically we are all closer to his side of the family than mine as we moved to his hometown.

I was a teacher and lots of kids had siblings, half-siblings, step siblings, with all sorts of name combinations - they were never confused about what the relationships were Smile

GuybrushThreepwodWasHere · 29/09/2012 14:03

My DH has his fathers last name and his sister has her mums last name (luckily they had one boy and one girl!). There was never any confusion and they are both very happy with their names.

Some people mesh last names (e.g. Smith and Williamson would become Willith or Smithson) which is nice if your names are compatible like that (mine and DH's isn't Sad)

hzgreen · 29/09/2012 13:26

Hello OP, I have no answers i'm afraid but am glad that i have found this thread as i am in the same situation. i kept my name when i married DH and we agreed that that the first child would have his neam and the second child will have mine regardless of gender. but as it turns out 1st child is a dDS and 2nd is likely to be DD.

i come from a divorced family and have my dads name which suits me and i'm proud to have it, most of my dad's family are dead, including him so it is really important to me to pass his name on even if it stops with my DD (i won't try to force her to keep it or anything). my DH and i are at peace with this decision but MiL is visiting today and has gently expressed concernes about how this will affect DC's (when i say gently i am being genuine, she is a lovely lady). SHe is concerned that they will be confused by it and that other people will assume that they have different fathers.

i realise that this may be a selfish decision but like you i am wondering if i am going too far or have just bought into the hysteria that another poster mentioned. so am very interested to see what other think.

see, i told you i would be no help... Sad

tribpot · 20/09/2012 21:24

A friend of my mum did as you are proposing, OP - although for slightly different reasons. One side of the family was nearly all boys, so the girl had that surname, and vice versa on the other. Something like that, anyway.

Never caused any problems at all that I'm aware of. No confusion on the part of the children as to their parentage or that one was loved more than the other. It's hardly the most complicated set-up for teachers to remember!

My ds has never asked me why I have a different surname to him, even though he knows I do. I don't think he thinks it's very important. I grew up in a large blended family where some people didn't even have the same first names as other people thought they did (my step-dad's ex-wife unilaterally changed her DD's name at the age of 11, so everyone who met her since then called her one name and we call her another). Sharing a surname was a luxury when I were a lass Wink

Clearly it's important to some people to share a name. That's absolutely their call. If it's important to you to share the names in a different way - that's your right too, and you don't have to feel swayed by some of the mad arguments you've quoted in your opening post. "How will they know they are siblings?" - yes, everyone always asks for passport identification before admitting the person they are growing up with is a sibling Hmm

Yama · 20/09/2012 21:12

Okay, now that I have read the other posts on the thread I will try to address the (perceived) issues.

Why on earth would the opinion of teachers make a difference to a life decision? I am a teacher and wouldn't dream of judging a child because they have a different surname to their sibling. I am disappointed that people in 2012 think that a child would receive negative treatment because of something outwith their control.

And as for siblings thinking that they are a favourite or not due to a decision made in the first 3 weeks of their life? Well I'm sure it's the day to day that resonates with most children. They are not daft in my experience.

TheCalmingManatee · 20/09/2012 21:00

Why can you only answer this if you are a feminist?? Im sorry but that really annoys me, is it like some sort of club that you can only join if you have a specific set of rules?

I am not a feminist (I have some feminist views, but i consider myself a woman, if i have to have a label at all!)

So, bearing in mind that my opinion wont matter a jot i will give it anyway.

I have two DDs, they both have different fathers, there is a considerable age gap. I am not married to my DP although we have been together for many years. Since DD1 was 2. When i became pregnant with my DD2, i was adamant that my baby would have my surname. This was because of DD1, i chose this route because I didn't want DD1 to feel "out of it" in terms of the family dynamic , this was a small way, in my mind, of keeping things coherant. It was never in my mind that i would leave my DP. It never really occured to me that she would have his name - we are not married, but even if we were to marry i would keep my name as i have a doctorate and wouldn't want to lose that. My DPs parents were not impressed and still refer to DD in cards with his surname. Thats their choice, im not going to get in a froth about it. DP isn't overly bothered about it either.

That is what i did - what someone else does is up to them.

Yama · 20/09/2012 20:59

I have read op only. I will read everyone else's post once I have articulated my way.

I am married. Both dh and I kept our own names.

Dd has my name, ds has dh's.

A pair of siblings so in love with each other you will not meet.

Only dd is old enough to understand the name issue (nearly 7). She is (and always has been) aware that people can have different names.

Dh and I are proud that our children will (hopefully) have an outlook based on reality. Obviously the name issue is not the only feminist issue they will grow up being aware of.

Your way is going well here op!

NellyBluth · 20/09/2012 20:55

Margery, can you back that comment about unplanned pregnancies up? Pretty much everyone I know has become pg deliberately, including those of us who have the surname dilemma. That's an incredibly sweeping statement to say most are unplanned.

Outofnappies · 20/09/2012 20:51

Re-read my post... Sons, daughters, I do think full siblings should have the same surname, my DC (4 and2) love repeating their names to each other.

Outofnappies · 20/09/2012 20:48

Hyphenate both your surnames? Or use yours as middle name..? I think it is really important that your children, sons especially, have the same surname. It is a bond and it will last forever.

WidowWadman · 20/09/2012 20:41

If you don't want equality what are you doing in the feminist section?

Also, I reserve the right to call those who oppose equality stupid.

The thread is not about naming children which are the result of an unplanned pregnancy after a one night stand and where the father has no involvement, so your objection doesn't quite fit either here.

margerykemp · 20/09/2012 20:34

I domt want 'equality'. I've never asked for it.

Dont call me stupid.

Moat people dont 'have a child together', they have sex and either through contraceptive failure or not, become pregannt. Planned pregnancies are in the minority.

WidowWadman · 20/09/2012 19:45

"I think DCs should always have the mother's surname as 99% of the time it it the Mum who keeps the DCs after a split (which ther is a 45% chance of by the time DCs are 16.) It's a simple numbers game. "

I think it should not be the default situation that children stay with the mothers after a separation. If you want to keep that as status quo, you might as well give up on the idea of wanting to achieve equality. And therefore I think defaulting the name to the mother's is stupid too.

If you're adult enough to decide to have a child together you should be adult enough to make a decision about the names together, may it be mother's, father's or a double-barreled one.

sashh · 20/09/2012 12:09

You are proposing to do something very similar to te wy names are passed on in Iceland - they are not all completly confused about their names.

Many children have siblings with different surnames. It can be an advantage for the younger one as when they get to school (if it is the same as their siblings) no one automatically compares them.

If the kids hate it when they ae old enough to decide then they can change it, or they might decide they want a different surname to both parents.

margerykemp · 20/09/2012 10:17

I think DCs should always have the mother's surname as 99% of the time it it the Mum who keeps the DCs after a split (which ther is a 45% chance of by the time DCs are 16.) It's a simple numbers game.

BertieBotts · 20/09/2012 09:18

I know a few families where the girls have mum's surname and the boys have dad's.

My sister and I found it more upsetting as children when we had the same surname but nobody else did - at family gatherings on my mum's side everyone had her surname, and at family gatherings on my dad's side everyone had my stepmum's surname, and we were always different. But having said that, it wasn't a massive deal (and after dad and stepmum had children together we all had the same name anyway).

I'd go with the one gender one name policy but let them know they can change it with no hard feelings if they'd like to, once they're old enough not to want to change it to Spiderman or something Grin

somuchforanindiansummer · 20/09/2012 09:13

Thanks all for the thoughts - quite a mix and good to have different view points. I didn't want to go with hypenation for double-barrelling with DS1 because our names are both a bit of a mouthful and putting them together sounded weird. But I do think seeker has a point that it would have just taken a while to get used to it.

I think one of my concerns is what some posters have mentioned about perceived favouritism, or taking sides on one surname vs other surname, etc. I do remember that as a kid really daft things could really matter, and that is one of the main reasons I am hesitating about this - I don't want to dig my heels in about it if is going to cause upset for the kids later on. But equally it seems not to be a problem for lots of families. I guess there's no way of knowing till it comes up (or doesn't)...

Hmmmmm.....

OP posts:
seeker · 20/09/2012 08:31

Any names hyphenate. Some take more getting used to than others.

Oh, and remember it's everyone hyphenated or only the children. I have a friend who has hyphenated her own name and the children's but her dp hasn't. That is seriously weird!

YouBrokeMySmoulder · 20/09/2012 08:30

All this blather about confusion and children being upset - we havent experienced any of that though we are a blended family so maybe that makes a difference.

Noone has Dhs surname thank god as its rubbish and doesnt go with anything.

If you've got multi-syllable names you cant double barrel them or you will look like a complete arse imo. Fine if one of your surnames is a smith or a jones.

NellyBluth · 20/09/2012 08:17

This is really interesting to read. I happily let DD (DC1) have DP's name, though we are not married and not planning on it ever. But since then I have been mulling over the idea of DC2 having my surname. I've had the same reactions whenever I have mentioned it, especially the 'confusion' idea - though no one batted an eyelid about 'confusion' about DD having a different surname to me! And we don't have surnames that double-barrel well at all.

But Himalaya makes a good point about the DCs potentially having worries when they are old enough to realise the difference in names. I hadn't thought of that.

But its your choice, and I do think that along with double-barreling, it is a good compromise when the parents have different surnames.

Himalaya · 20/09/2012 07:57

There is no perfect solution to this one - every version is a compromise.

Personally I do think giving to kids with the same parentage different surnames is giving them some reason to think you/your DH/ different sets of GPs love one or other of them more.

I know that is ridiculous, but kids do worry about that stuff, and like to know that everything down to number of biscuits in the pack are being shared equally.

One of your kids will be better looking than the other, one will be smarter, one will be sportier. They will know this. One may get the idea that they are not your/dh's favourite, and the surname thing could compound this.

Could you not double barrel?

WofflingOn · 20/09/2012 07:08

Considering the number of ridiculous MIL threads there are on this site, you'd be better off giving boys the mother's surname and the girls their father's surname.

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