Positives and negatives of the Olympics.

the point is that the biggest competition in women's football is the Olympics. And British women of every nationality are prevented from competing in it because of the needs of the men's teams. So they ALL lose out.

Realistically, is a talented Wales or NI footballer going to have a better chance of competing internationally in a Welsh team or a GB team? A GB team, right? And that goes for women AND men, of course. And a GB team would theoretically be better because they had a wider pool of talent to draw from. One of the advantages - for the men - of fielding a Team GB is that Ryan Giggs has finally been able to play in a proper top flight international tournament. So everybody has more to gain from having a GB football team instead of English, Welsh, etc. teams.

But we don't because the individual FAs don't want to lose their autonomy. Who benefits from this? Well I don't think anybody does, but the women least of all because they're prevented from playing in the biggest tournament of their sport.

If there was a technical issue preventing the men's team from competing in the World Cup, don't you think that would be overcome? And do you think that they would give a shit if overcoming that issue meant disadvantaging the women - of course not!

I doubt it, TBH.

Answer me this: does women's football have as high a profile, and as much funding as men's?

Did a group of female footballers, as well financed and supported as the men, with equal clout in an organization, get together and decide how to form up teams for themselves?

"Of course, if you want to stick your head in the sand and sing 'Nah nah, nasty menz....', please carry on."

FGS Namechangeguy, why don't you read the rest of the thread and you'll see how happy we all are that men and women are supporting each other so why on earth you are making out that we are looking for reasons to denigrate men is not only beyond me, but it's irritating as well as inaccurate.

You may well be right about the politics of the previous Olympics, but you can hardly deny that FA support for women's football has been lacking in the past, and that women footballers have faced all manner of obstacles (funding, support, etc) that men footballers simply haven't. Call it whatever you want, deny it's sexism, I don't care, I'm talking about the effect not the "complicated" reasons that you are so quick to offer.

But I get the feeling that I am talking to a brick wall because you obviously have an agenda that you are sticking to, so to quote yourself back at you:

Of course, if you want to stick your head in the sand and sing 'oh you overreacting feminists....', please carry on.

Now, jog on and stop ruining my high

LRD, no it isnt hard to understand. Which is why I am saying that permanently having four UK teams is better than having one GB team. Some people on here are arguing that it's a sexist thing. It isn't. It's a national identity thing. I think you and I are agreeing.

namechange, surely I would want there to be more female players playing for lots of teams ... more like the men?

Is that too hard to understand?

Okay, so let's imagine you a NI or Welsh woman footballer. You want to play at the WC and the Euro's. Do you want to play for NI/Wales, or do you want to compete against women from the other three nations as well as your own for a place in the GB squad? You come from a smaller catchment where your chances of being picked are greater. If you are in a larger pool, including Scots and English (who have far more players to choose from), then your chances of representing your country are reduced dramatically. Plus the Scots and English FAs have much more money, better infrastructure, better training facilities etc. So it's an uneven playing field from day one.

Of course, if you want to stick your head in the sand and sing 'Nah nah, nasty menz....', please carry on. But to move to a GB squad will lessen some women's (and men's) chances of representing the country of their birth, and I don't think they would thank you for it.

There was a comment on the football coverage last night that this is the first time the women have played at Wembley.

I really hope that this is because it is a GB team (ie first time Women's GB team have played at Wembley), rather than first time women have played at Wembley. Surely the England Women's football team have played Wembley before?

I don't follow how there's no sexism?

Surely worries about autonomy that result in women not being included are evidence of sexism somewhere - unless having a vagina makes you an automatic threat to autonomy of any group in which you participate?

I came on here because I just saw the women's gold for the rowing, and was thrilled. That is so good to see!

Getting back to the conversation of the sexes of the medal winners/teams - I agree totally, messy, that seeing men and women supporting each other and winning alongside each other is the best thing and amazing to watch.

I was also thinking that, given the men's gymnastics is the only male-only event we've won, there must be lots of little boys for whom that's the most visible 'male' event we've won - and it's not traditionally masculine. Those men are phenomenally strong and fit, and I really like that it is showing how the stereotypes about these things are completely false. Maybe now we'll have more boys thinking 'wow, I want to do that' as well as 'wow, I want to play football'. And getting people doing a wider range of things has got to be good, hasn't it?

Whatever, namechangeguy, call it whatever you want, but the effect is still the same.

oh gosh how could I forget the men's gymnasts!!!!
I need a spreadsheet - so many medals now.

Just a big HOORAY for women's Football! I think they do indeed put the men to shame, obviously giving it their all and proud to wear the shirt.
But then they're not overpaid whiny idiots like the men are they? (I'm thinking about male professional footballers in general.)

I stand by what I said, namechangeguy. The women were prevented because they were worried about setting a precedent. And their concerns were not for the womens' game but the men's. I'm quite sure that the Scottish, Welsh and NI womens' footballers would have jumped at the chance of playing for GB after Beijing if it meant that they got an opportunity to play internationally.

But they couldn't because the FAs didn't want a Team GB. And their concern was for hte men, not for the women.

The reasons for no GB football team, men or women, in the past are a bit more complicated than sexism. Because the UK has four FA's - England, Scotland, N Ireland and Wales - all four have resisted in the past. They are worried about their autonomy, and not being able to qualify for World Cups and Euros separately, as FIFA and UEFA might force them to field a single GB squad. The UK Olympics is a special case, and it wont happen again.

So not sexism, but jobs for the 'smaller' FA's and national identity protection. Sorry to disappoint.

Treats - don't ruin my high!

I seem to remember reading that last time the women's football drew such a crowd (about 50,000 I think) back in the 1920s or something, the FA responded by banning women's football giving the pathetic excuse that it was unladylike and not good for their reproductive organs.

Still, they're back on track now - hopefully the Olympics will change that. I'm certainly up for becoming a women's football fan now I've seen it proper..

I'm just happy it's such a mixture of men and women and it's awesome to see her regiment really supporting her. It's just great to see men supporting women and vice versa. That's what it should be like all the time.

I'm really enjoying the women's football - especially last night's match against Brazil. I really hope it's the start of a higher profile for women's football in this country - a bit more television coverage. I don't see why they can't shoehorn a 'best of the women's league' match highlights onto the end of the MOTD coverage, or feature one of the women's matches on the weekly 5Live coverage. There's all sorts of shit talked about how women's football isn't as interesting or that people just don't want to watch it. I think the Olympics is proving them all wrong.

Here's a classic bit of sexism to make you all though. The England women's football team qualified automatically for the football tournament in Beijing (by being runners up in the European Championship I think?) but weren't allowed to play because the FA didn't want to set a precedent of creating a GB team. So, not only do the men's FA not support women's football, or share the airtime or the sponsorship, they also prevent them from playing in tournaments when it doesn't suit the mens' game.

The women are only allowed to play in this Olympics at all because it suited the men's agenda to field a GB team now that we're hosts. I am happy to see that the women have so far outshined their male counterparts in every way!

No men's gymnastics have also won a medel so almost hiphop

GB medals obviously.

Yes women get the first GOLD!!!! Fantastic. Apart from the Eventers (mixed team) all medals to date are from women aren't they? I'm just loving seeing so may sportswomen on the telly all the time.

Wooohooo!! The first gold!!

I am not at all a sport-watching person, but I so enjoyed watching the women's football last night - not just because they beat Brazil but also it's lovely to see an image of women being strong and working as a team!

(because they were so defined and muscled and not thinner-than-their-knees like some women in magazines)

The male gymnasts had much more done hair than the men in most sports.

The female gymnasts were quite glittery, but on the bouncy floor (whatever it's called) I was busy thinking look at her thighs!

I do think that part of it is a younger generation of commentator.

Matt Baker, Clare Balding and Jake Humphries spring to mind immediately - their commentary is very asexual, if they weren't using gender specific pronouns then you would hardly know which sex they were talking about.

I also liked the fact that they had women experts talking about the women's football in the studio last night, rather than getting in the usual BBC male football pundits.