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Original poster

<SIGH> Come hold my hand and tell me to speak up

39 replies

NormaSparklerFlashBangAhhh · 21/11/2011 17:01

I have been interviewing for a junior post at work (it is a skilled post probably paying 30k ish)

The team in this country is v male.

I am (or thought I was) well respected both inside and outside the company.

There is a fair amount of banter, some of it, well, probably sexist.

But the constant insistence from males at all levels of seniority that I 'choose a hot one', the 'was she pretty?. Yes? Then choose her' comments are getting me down.

Advice?

OP posts:
purplepidjin · 21/11/2011 20:44

"Shame they didn't apply that policy when they hired you" should shut them up, although it doesn't exactly strike a blow for feminism Hmm

forkful · 21/11/2011 20:42

See www.stopsexistremarks.org/ for some inspiration.

PlumpDogPillionaire · 21/11/2011 20:10

It makes perfect sense, Norma.
It's not good that whilst (in UK at least) there are laws in place that are supposed to safeguard against that sort of behaviour - and make quite clear that even 'jokes' can actually be harassment and/or discrimination, so many of us still feel that we have to be 'good humoured' and accepting of this kind of behaviour, which is just so, so, so crap, draining, depressing, disorientating and useless - and occasionally quite threatening.
It's also mildly perplexing that 'men' dim and childish enough to behave like that can find their way into interesting or responsible careers, since the conclusion that one might draw from their behaviour/'humour' is that they wouldn't be capable of finding their own arses with both hands.

TheRealTillyMinto · 21/11/2011 19:27

Some order feminists = Some other feminists...

TheRealTillyMinto · 21/11/2011 19:21

Yes it makes perfect sense. You have every right to decide that their 'joke' that you initially tolerated (had to tolerate...), has crossed the line.

(I dont think they are joking by the way)

Some order feminists would probably disagree with me, but i think you should keep bring the debate back to its offensive to women and the best candidate should be hired for the role.

this is one of those times when feminism and business goals align.

Original poster
NormaSparklerFlashBangAhhh · 21/11/2011 19:12

Have rung my line manger tonight (he has been on leave when all this has been going on and is still on leave, but we are often in touch out of hours on work stuff) and he supports me. We don't have an hr department in this country. We are an outpost.

I guess part of why this is hard is that it crept up. And they do genuinely think it is joking and lighthearted. Bit it has gone too far now for me.

Does that make sense?

OP posts:
PlumpDogPillionaire · 21/11/2011 18:37

You'd be well within your rights to complain about discrimination or possibly even harassment in relation to this behaviour.

I can completely understand that you might not want to do that if you want to keep reasonably amicable working relationships with these 'men', but the behaviour that you describe is unacceptable and it's quite bizarre that they think they can say these sorts of things, however 'lighthearted' they might think they're being.

You could have a quiet word with HR, or you could point out very nicely to your colleagues that their behaviour is, in law (if you're in the UK), discriminatory and successful claims have been made against companies because of this sort of behaviour. Also point out, though, very seriously, that you really don't like this behaviour: it's belittling, insulting and intimidating.

If that doesn't work, go to HR. If they don't deal with it as a serious matter, think about getting legal advice.

Oh, and keep a diary of what's said, your responses, and what is (or isn't) consequently done about this behaviour.

TheButterflyEffect · 21/11/2011 17:37

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheButterflyEffect · 21/11/2011 17:36

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SardineQueen · 21/11/2011 17:33

"ha ha very funny yes obviously that's what I'm looking for" deadpan might work?

It's so hard with work stuff, i really feel for you. This "hiring a fit one" thing has been the case at everywhere I've worked. Not that anyone hired based on attractiveness (AFAIK) but that was all anyone asked about.

Original poster
NormaSparklerFlashBangAhhh · 21/11/2011 17:28

That is exactly it. I guess that is why I am here, to put it down in words so that I can formulate what I want to say. Just having to type what I have so far has helped.

OP posts:
allhailtheaubergine · 21/11/2011 17:19

Okay, so it sounds as though you have been responding to their 'joking' in a similarly jokey way - I know you mean what you are saying, but perhaps they don't?

Would it be more effective to say something calmly and seriously?

Original poster
NormaSparklerFlashBangAhhh · 21/11/2011 17:14

Disgust. Rolling of eyes. Calling them stupid shallow human beings. Pointing out that unlike them I am an intelligent person who will choose the best candidate.

But I really feel that I need to say to managers that this is not acceptable.

I feel like it has gone beyond a joke and is reflecting on the validity of the position of all the female staff - as in - what were the criteria for us to be appointed? Looks?

OP posts:
allhailtheaubergine · 21/11/2011 17:05

How have you responded so far?