group dynamics in majority female/minority male groups

MAT what's your point exactly?

TRTM, had this link sent over to me a while back

www.livescience.com/9038-attractive-women-hired.html

if a women keeps another women down, it 'says something about the bitchiness of women', if a man keeps another man down (not saying that is ok) it is 'just competition... a natural thing'.

double standards.

SGM, the comments were vile and though I've not been here very long I'd be shocked if they weren't addressed and deleted.

SGM what theads have you been on?!

me too. worked a treat.

SGM I am and I did!

I am not disputing any of what you are saying MAT but I'm sure if I could be arsed I could find the same kind of stuff about males. It doesn't make any of it right. Your first post implied female on female bullying was worse, more damaging and happened more often than male on male and male on female (or vice versa) that's what I am questioning. But as I said before if you are right then perhaps we should be considering it on another thread.

Blackduck, let me get back to you on that one.

When the Wrong Woman Wins - Building Bullies and Perpetuating Patriarch

www.worktrauma.org/womanandgeneral/womens_issues.htm

"This is also a damaging dynamic, because women who oppress other women help to maintain the existing social order in which men remain dominant and women are subordinate (Acker, 1990; Brunner & Costello, 2002)."

"For thirty years we have wanted to believe that any woman manager would be a welcome change in any organization. We also have wanted to believe that as a woman climbed the corporate ladder she would extend her hand to other women following the leadership path. Recognizing that women are more likely than men to bully other women is hard to accept and even harder to discuss in a public forum. But the statistics should not be ignored. If half of the bullies in the workplace are women, then women managers need to assume responsibility for analyzing their roles and contributions to this organizational dynamic. Even one bully is too many. "

i wonder if in schools, the difference is girls are generally more verbal than boys at a young age (a topic for a completely different thread but DP & i were discussing this & wondered if women mature faster because our forbears who didnt had a greater chance of dying due to greater care of boy children... stepping away from that topic....)

so the whole concept of girls being bitchey is just a way of putting us down for being good at something.

ah, no boobs. not a real woman. reminds me of gi jane 'suck my dick' having attained the mythical status of manhood at last.

insults are very telling.

But as Messy pointed out do they vary? or do we just call them different things?

I agree Tilly.

Think of your average worker drone (like me for eg) moaning about their boss.

Now switch the bosses' gender. Totally different vocab.

Blackduck, the tactics used in female and male bullying do vary and I didn't put any labels to them. Research, is indicating it is different and female/female bullying research is way behind that which studies male bullying.

but when comparing male/female bullys, arent there just the ominipresent double standards being applied again and again again

i just dont think the same vocab is used when a man says something bitchey.

eejit

I think the interesting thing about bullying is that, regardless of gender, it plays on the harmful patriarchal stereotypes that exist in society to put down its victims. For example when my DS was bullied he was called "gay" even though the kids probably didn't have an idea of what that meant. It was just an available insult with which to hurt.

And one of the insults this super mean girl levelled at me at school was that I had no boobs!!! LOL......

Sincal - very true re men in the workplace - lots of insiduous ways of sidelining women.

MAT I don't think anyone said they thought that female on female bullying is less likely than male on male or male or female, but was questioning whether it is worse (not that it is a competition anyway). I, for one, amy not disputing that it happens and you have found reports etc but its the notion that females are nastier, bitchier and harsher. If that is indeed the case perhaps we should be asking why that is the case, but I think that is another thread.

I think peer pressure is there for both boys and girls, it may exhibit itself in different ways, but that doesn't mean it is present. I know men who were bullied at school and can equally recall every momnet of it.

mmmmmmm, i know i shouldn't put this here, because it's thread about thread stuff, but i was screaming 'handmaiden!' at the top of my lungs duirng that 'sensible news reporter does bunting' q and a. i'd so love to talk to her about her reasons - i mean, it is of course perfeclty acceptable for a working woman to enjoy a nice bit of domesticity, but i just had a horrible taste in my mouth as though it was a nice money spinner that meant she wasn't too threatening to the patriarchy at all, and might be able to keep her job when she lost her looks. not that the uk like their news chicks purty, or anything. oh no. but i resisted using the term handmaiden on the thread, as i was mostly irridescent with fury at the title of the damn book and wasn't amking much sense. but i'm over it.