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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

If you could choose... would you rather have been born male?

210 replies

wellwisher · 19/09/2011 14:13

I don't post in this section much, but this is inspired by the "Do you remember a specific moment where you realised that being female put you at a disadvantage?" thread.

I have become more feminist/aware of the disadvantages of being female as I've got older. The last few years, I've realised that if I could choose, I'd rather be male. I'm at an age where I'm starting to lose my looks and panic about my biological clock, and I resent that my male friends don't have these worries yet. Almost all my female friends have settled down and started to have children, often making major compromises to do so. Almost all my male friends are still single and enjoying their freedom. It feels so unfair! It's more than that though: women have so much additional CRAP to deal with - prejudice, misogyny, objectification, being punished by society for getting older/not being conventionally pretty, feeling physically vulnerable... honestly, if I could go back to the moment of my conception, wave a magic wand and be created male instead of female, I would do it in a snap. Yet, none of my female friends feel the same way - even though most of them are relatively feminist in their views.

Maybe I just feel like this because I don't have children. Maybe it's just me, am generally a bit gloomy at the moment... but I thought it could be an interesting discussion. What would you choose? Try to set aside any feelings associated with having had babies, as this clearly adds a huge emotional aspect to the issue. I hope that any future children of mine will be boys. I really feel I wouldn't wish being born female on anyone - and I'm aware of how easy women in the UK have it compared to most of the rest of the world.

OP posts:
HeavyHeidi · 19/09/2011 19:27

I would, of course, rather be me and change the world instead.

But when I thought how much easier my life would be if I was a man..yes, I wish I was born one. I would not have to work twice as hard to be taken seriously at work. I could raise my voice and people would just say I have a strong personality. I could have slept around as single and have the reputation of a stud, not slut. I would not have the biological clock ticking and everybody reminding me of that. I could have kids and keep working, nobody would call me a bad parent who tries to "have it all". And so on.

Well, I'm doing the best I can and should not really complain about my life.. but it is such an uphill struggle sometimes..

exoticfruits · 19/09/2011 19:25

Ican't even think that it has been a disadvantage at any point.

exoticfruits · 19/09/2011 19:24

Absolutely love being female. I always have, I had 2 brothers and can remember being very young and very thankful that I was a girl.

BoffinMum · 19/09/2011 19:18

I prefer my genitalia how they are, but I think on balance men have it easier in a number of important ways, and perhaps I would have been very happy as a bloke. The idea of having children without compromising your body, having a career path assumed rather than tolerated, and being able to go where I like without fear of physical attack is very tempting.

Catitainahatita · 19/09/2011 19:16

I don't think so. Perhaps when I was 8 or 9. I'm quite happy being me and also quite optimistic that things will get better for women as a group. It's so easy to get depressed at how crap certain things are now, but in comparision to how things were 30, 50 or 100 years ago, women's prospects in the UK and even where I live in Mexico have improved immensely. I think we just have not ignore the idea that women have nothing to complain about anymore and feminism is thus useless. It's just an effort to get us to shut up and accept the status quo.

I remember stating this very clearly in a conversation years ago and offended many people, but I shall say it again with the proviso that I am not trying to offend anyone, just explain my pov:

I think that in the 20th century the very patriarchal society in the west has come round to the idea that women have to be offered equal rights. The male ordered world seems to be alright with this as long as it doesn't mean that men-as-a-group should have to make changes in their behaviour or sacrifice their comforts. That is to say women can be accepted as long as the accept default majority is masculine and it is women who have to "adapt" in order to fit in. I want the world to change so that women as well as men fit into it without the need for special adaptions. This means that much of patriarchal society and its culture needs to be changed and men-as-a-group will have to modify their behaviour and expectations.

As far as I can understand from my interactions with people, it is precisely this aim of changing behaviour and expectations which provokes so much hostility from people, some male some female. It's quite understandable as no one really likes having to give up privileges and it can feel like you are being discriminated against. But imho it needs to be done if we are to enjoy a truely equal society.

NeedToSleepZZZ · 19/09/2011 19:12

I think I would like to try it for a day or so, just to feel the difference in the way I am treated and regarded by others. On the whole I am pretty happy being a woman but when I was pregnant I was frightened of having a girl because of the world we live in. I now have a son and feel it's oh's and my duty to raise him with awareness of feminist issues and to view equality as the only way, well I can dream.

I would happily have forgone pregnancy, not childbirth though.

madwomanintheattic · 19/09/2011 19:07

what fluffles and sgm said.

i'm an individual.

i see as many traps in masculinity as there are in femininity. living as a not particularly 'feminine' woman has it's drawbacks, but living as a not very 'masculine' man would also be problematic from a cultural pov.

i've had three kids. i still identify primarily as a person/ human/ individual and not particularly as a woman. it's just what i am. it doesn't define me. if i was a bloke i suspect i'd feel the same.

HerdOfTinyElephants · 19/09/2011 18:52

No. Not in general, and even less so as I am getting older and feel more at ease in my own skin. I think as a woman I have more choices obviously open to me than I would as a man (I may not get as far down some of those paths as I would if I were male, but I am aware even now that there is far more societal pressure on DS not to do stuff perceived as "for girls" than there is on the DDs not to do stuff perceived as "for boys"). And I don't think it's possible to set aside feelings associated with having had babies; having them and nurturing them is what I've spent a good deal of the last few years doing.

And I really wouldn't want a penis.

StewieGriffinsMom · 19/09/2011 18:35

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AliceWyrld · 19/09/2011 18:34

I wouldn't and I have no idea why.

sunshineandbooks · 19/09/2011 18:32

Hmm. Interesting question.

Generally, I love being a woman, despite being penalised for it by society.

However, I would love to have a traditional 'wife' (except I would of course be a fab husband who pulled his weight, never pressured for sex and really appreciated what my wife did for me Wink).

I did try the house-husband arrangement but it didn't really work because he was a twat. Grin

Yama · 19/09/2011 18:07

My last sentence is only relevant as a means of comparison.

Yama · 19/09/2011 18:06

When I was pregnant with dc1, I was single. I was petrified of having a girl because of the way the world is. I would lie awake at night worrying about how I would protect her. Well, dc1 is a girl and I suppose I am learning that I need to show her how to protect herself.

So, in answer to your question no I wouldn't rather have been born male. I am better able to fight sexism and misogyny (for my daughter) as a woman and mother.

Also, I have had a better life (so far) than my brothers.

reallyslummymummy · 19/09/2011 17:50

I would really love to be a man for a day but not forever - I love being a woman. However, I have always wondered what it would feel like to be a man having sex with a woman.

Tchootnika · 19/09/2011 17:47

No way would I prefer to have been born male - unless, I suppose, I was born pre-1920, in which case, maybe... Or pre-1820, in which case definitely.

I don't think society now makes things easier for men - even though of course in many ways it still has strong overtones of patriarchy, misogyny, etc. (but you see I don't think these things do make things easier for men, I think they just make things fucking horrible for everyone). I think in many ways things are difficult for most of us, male or female. I don't think men have it better - which isn't to say that feminism couldn't still make things better for everyone.

Why, AnyFucker? Tell us more, please!

PamBeesly · 19/09/2011 17:38

wellwisher society makes things easier for men so I understand that for sure but I wouldn't trade in being a woman for it
Do you want to have a baby? Good luck with it :)

AnyFucker · 19/09/2011 17:38

Interesting question

I think I would actually

wellwisher · 19/09/2011 17:33

Hmm, (nearly) just me then? Maybe I should try to have a baby...

Just to be clear, I am a girly girl and not in any way struggling with my gender identity! I just think men have it so much easier... :(

OP posts:
caramelwaffle · 19/09/2011 17:10

No.

ComradeJing · 19/09/2011 16:50

Nope, I'd rather stay female.

blackcurrants · 19/09/2011 16:47

I would have said yes as a child and a teen I think, cos it looks like an easier life. Not now, though. Nothing could persuade me to give up growing and feeding and raising my LO. And I cant disregard it, it is too fundamental to how I see myself as a woman.

Plus, I couldnt give up my female friends. I dont know a man who has friendships with other menthe way most of the women I know have with other women.

in short, while it is no easier being female, I am getting better at it, and better at being a grownup in general. And I like it, even though the patriarchy must be overturned! I n the "riots not diets!" style I should say, I dont want to change me, I want to change the world.

fluffles · 19/09/2011 16:05

no, i don't think so, because i wouldn't like to conform to society's expectation of 'masculinity' any more than i like to confirm to the expectation of 'femininity'.

i am just me, and what i am in terms of behaviours and interests is really quite gender-neutral.

PamBeesly · 19/09/2011 15:57

No way, not in a million years, I'd hate to be male. I don't live in the UK. Maybe at some stage in my life I might feel like you but for now I love being a woman. I don't think I'd feel as free being a man (even though that could be because I 'know' being a woman and I'd feel restricted being a man)

TrillianAstra · 19/09/2011 15:56

No thanks.

ChickensHaveNoEyebrows · 19/09/2011 15:54

If I'm honest, right now....yes. I'm not very good at being a woman in the way that society seems to demand that I be, I don't feel fulfilled through being a mother and I'm more disposed to selfishness than selflessness. I would have been happier as a man, I think.