"Honour killing"

The so-called bit seems a bit obvious. The key word is killing. Killing is wrong we shouldn't have to quantify it.

Sorry, genuine query, why must honour or honourable be deplored?

I can think of tonnes of examples of people behaving "honourably" which would not be opressive to women.

Keeping your word is an honourable thing to do.
I once agreed to shareva flat with a friend, then got the offer of a better flatshare with someone else, hut stuck with the originak deal. My friend thanked me and said I had done the honourable thing.

What am I missing?

I think that's the point isn't it? To identify and protect the people who are most at risk - not, as someone suggested earlier, as a ranking exercise in which some sorts of murder are worse than others or attempt to differentiate in some other way but because some groups are more (hate the v word at the moment) than others.

I suppose one positive aspect of using the phrase 'honour killing' is that many people will find the word 'honour' develops nasty associations for them. And that would be a good thing, because it is absolutely true, as has been said, that no system of honour has ever been anything other than oppressive of women.

Incidentally, this is making me think about the term virtue, which comes from the same word as 'man' and pretty much implies that all honourable, good, moral qualities are inherently masculine. I know it'd be naive to pretend culture isn't a huge factor in discussing these murders, but I don't think any culture is immune to misogynistic constructions of 'honour'.

I think "so-called honour killings" is clear in a way "honour killings" is not.

Also, in terms of recording, if we have an idea of the scale of the problem of honour killings in UK, tackling this problem with the appropriate organisations can be properly funded.

Yes, I agree with that. It is telling the reader about the motivation behind the murder i.e. honour plus it is pointing out the obvious fact that it is a crime, too. It is also brief and not a mouthful to say each time. Just the right phrase to use.

Agree with Mitchiest Inge.

I quoted Southall Black Sisters, because they deal with honour based crimes on every level and I respect that they know far more about this then me.

The other issue is this. There have been several cases where women went to the police, told them she feared her family were going to kill her for reasons of supposed 'honour', they didn't believe her and she was subsequently murdered (yes, I know this has happened in DV cases too). By using the term 'honour based crime, you're making it clear why this happened and that it does happen.

it's important to give those killings a name that betrays their motivation though, as we do with hate crime - not in a Napoleonic Code defensive (crimes of passion) way of course

not that can think of a better name myself

Most women's organisations already write so-called honour or write it as as 'honour' killings - just need to get the media to catch up!

Yes, Hullygully, that is wholly accurate. Well, in my view, anyway; but it's a bit of a mouthful to use that when reporting stories.
If 'so-called' before the words 'honour killings' was used by all the press, then it would be challenging the notion that these killings were in any way shape or form 'honourable'.
Instead of people thinking, 'oh it's an honour killing so it is somehow OK, people would perhaps pick up on the 'so-called' bit and challenge the notion that it had anything to do with honour.

If anybody who believed in these 'honour' killings then complained, it would just be refuted with 'sorry, but our journalist feels that these killings do not, in any way, chime with his/her notions of honourability'. Which is totally reasonable and fair.

Only words at the end of the day, I suppose, but just a few thoughts.

Either that or you could start saying things more clearly?

Just a thought.

I did think it was pretty relevant saying as how it was from a website called "Stop Honour Killings!" and all.

Shall I name change to SelfDeclaredRadicalFeminist?

We can never talk about feminist stuff without talking about the impact things have on men dammit TheCrackFox - where the fuck do you think you are? A feminist board.....or somethi...

oh.

"Murder in the name of a Medieval Patriarchal Code" works for me.

Perhaps it would be better to put the words 'so-called' in front of 'honour killings'? But I doubt that will catch on.

Bob, we are truly, truly sorry for all the wrongs women have committed against man since time immemorial. Can we go back to discussing feminist stuff now?

Bob and Edd?

I like, time to write this one off to the BBC to get a budget

Bob can be the intelligent one of many words but highly calculating, deadpan and passive aggressive. I'll be the clumsy illiterate one who provedes the slapstick

The premise of episode one will be Bob and Edd meet some radfems outside the 30 St Mary Axe building on London and get caught up in a plot to destroy it

I'd like it if you used long words too. And really complex sentences with difficult syntax and challenging punctuation.