You don't have to be feminist to post here, but it helps...

aibu is straightforward riposte and some aggro
here can be well if you knew and understood some key feminist principles,read a bit you wouldn't be so silly as to regurgitate and repeat ant-feminist sentiments....have you been drinking? there is very much a vibe of what is acceptable discourse and ehat isnt

Oops last post from me I promise - Beach you are acknowledging that in your opinion, new posters should swot up before posting here - it's not up to you or anyone else to set minimum requirements for posting here, or anywhere else on MN. As others have said, it's an open forum - make a closed on elsewhere if you don't want to talk to anyone and everyone.

Just to add - I will answer any 101 question I see, just as I'll continue to describe emotional abuse on Relationships.

What I will not do - any more - is stick around when a more technically-correct feminist tells me I've got it wrong, have explained it wrong or similar. When such things happened before, they did take the form of personal attacks: if I've bothered to reply, it's rude to trash what I said when the better-informed poster could enhance my reply instead.

I like the diversity that seems (to me) to be evolving here, with medium-light threads alongside the heavy ones. I'm sad that I still feel scared to post on the 'heavy' ones, but I seem to have other options now, besides reading and silently fuming. I, for one, hope this continues to develop.

On AIBU, it's generally only the OP who is subject to a torrent of abuse and even then it's unlikely to follow her from thread to thread.

I think there's something about posting emotional, truly-held opinions on the fem board and having them torn apart and told that you are variously supporting the patriarchy, a rape apologist or whatever that is much more hurtful than most AIBU rucks. I have been really hurt and shocked by comments made to me from regulars on here that I don't feel I invited in any way by my own posting style.

I will keep posting here and be honest and hope that things improve or I learn to toe the line, one of the two

I am a frequent namechanger and make no apologies for it btw so sorry to those who have spent time discussing with me as I feel it's poss time for a clean start again, one of the reasons being to prevent fem posters bringing up stuff I've said on past threads. Hate the post, not the poster. Au revoir fems.

Stripey, I don't think not wanting to have much of a discussion about for example false rape claims (in a feminist space) is particularly high brow.

I don't think people who are new to feminism who haven't encountered much feminist analysis should be dismissed, talked down to or made to feel they cannot explore 'beginner feminism' if you like.

Equally however I also don't think that posters should be encouraged to attack some of the more analytical discussions as being insane/extremist/man hating/whatever. Nor should they be encouraged to believe that every thread has to be accessible in terms of level of discussion to every poster who shows up.

I do also think that people need to take a little responsibility for their own education and do some reading rather than feel annoyed because other people, who have already put the reading work in, wish to discuss something that is outside their personal comfort zone.

This comes up a lot here and I think it would be useful to have a sticky that gives some explanation of feminist analysis/perspectives, some of the main patriarchal paradigms that feminists take issue with, and some links to sites such as feminist 101.

I think such a sticky would be useful because it would mean people would stop asking regular posters to go over the same basic tenets and concepts all the time and it would provide people who are genuinely interested with a handy shortcut to some of the more complex aspects of feminism.

I ought to go, but:

'Anyone can post on AIBU, most of MN can't post here due to the entry requirements.'

This is just not true. And it gets on my nerves. I'm posting here, right? Ask Dittany (or do a quick search), and you will find I do not come close to her idea of the minimum standard of knowledge of feminist theory. Loads of us don't. Ask SGB, and she would say my views on porn are all wrong. Ask Sakura and she could tell you, if she chose, that I totally misunderstand the way history should be looked at my feminists. Ask HereBeBollox and she will say that we have opposed views on high heels. So what?! We all have disagreements. We all fall short. There's a thread by posieparker right now talking about how hard it is to live up to ideals and lots of people acknowledge they don't and can't.

When you say 'most of MN can't post here', what you are basically saying is that the regulars here don't count, or we should feel like imposters because we have no clue what those 'entry requirements' are. You're making out that a forum that gets a shedload of traffic, is full of people you won't even dignify by recognizing. Do you not see that this is going to get up people's noses?

sb, I've pm'd you so as not to derail this discussion.

im specifically referring to being told certain topics are not for discussion or not welcome on feminist boards

not the general mileu of mn and the posting rules

Entry requirements?

I find AIBU a far sight more condescending than this place.

POG - what topic? blasted iPhone app

Really stripey? I have seen nastier and ruder responses on AIBU, TBH. Mind you, I guess they often get deleted! And people regularly flounce/pretend to flounce of AIBU. It's just not true to say anyone can post there - many feel they can't. And, yes, others tend to draw attention to the fact that disagreement is normal and if you don't like it, you will struggle in life.

On the current disabled/P&C thread, there is a lot of mocking laughter and silliness. Which is as good a response as any to prejudice.

SM - no, there are general rules that apply to the whole of MN, and they forbid namecalling etc. There's a disclaimer in AIBU telling people it's not a fight club. These parameters on discussion make MN a safe space. They should be remembered here.

LRD - yy there are disagreements in AIBU etc but not the and and 'not this again' and downright condescension that happens here. It's because there is a strong band of regulars - there is an assumption on here of certain povs and experience which isn't present anywhere else. Anyone can post on AIBU, most of MN can't post here due to the entry requirements.

yes a range topics should be discussed
nothing is off limits on open forum
and if you want a safe space with parameters on discussion maybe wont find on an open discursive forum.

stripey - look at AIBU and the responses to P&C parking threads!

SM - what's the problem if someone was furious and disagreed? I don't get it. Was she offensive to you? If so, report. If not, well, the world is full of people with differing passionately-held opinions ...

Beach - isn't it always going to happen on an open forum though? I mean what you call 'Feminism 101' statements can't be banned so that a handful of posters can have a high level discussion. Every other board in MN is open to all MNers regardless of pov or experience. The Fem board or at least certain discussions are not. If it is assumed that you have a certain knowledge set and belief system before you even post on a thread, it's not an open forum. What makes MN the fab open discussion place it is perhaps makes a dedicated board which is only welcoming to some posters a bit of an anomaly and disliked by much of MN.

for me,feminism is discussion,exploration,discourse.and i am intrigued by collective don't talk about that.the notion of making a topic off limits. i think thats what i despair about on the feminist board as i said the vibe of dont talk about that and how it is variously invoked

thats usually what causes all the aggro and name calling

I dunno SM - personnely I don't feel the need to robustly challenge feminist 101 level misunderstandings every time I encounter them. Nor do I feel I have some sort of duty to do so. Most of the time I would rather discuss stuff that interests me with people who are interested in feminist analysis than go over the same boring old rape myths over and over again.

thats the nub of it,assumption of certain topics=ok
other topics no,dont say that here
and thats how inevitability all the aggro commences. some are more verbose than others in asserting what can and cant be discussed

frankly i dont see any topic as off limits not at all.nor am i intellectually compromised for raising any topic.i am bemused at the notion certain topics are no no

i was on a thread about female dysfunction and criminality,and someone was apoplectic that i was discussing female criminality. her whole jist was yes but men do it too. Yes but female dysfunction is viewed within different frame of reference. and simply saying lets not discuss that isnt going to make a topic go away

scottishmummy, there are quite a lot of threads, including one with a title something like 'Feminism 101', that do talk about this question in more detail. If you're interested, would you like me to dig out some links to them?

I'm not trying to shut you up, but I reckon this is a bit off-topic from the OP!

instead of adopting a dont talk about here it stance is it not preferable to robustly challenge?

yes a tiny minority do lie about rape.its unfortunate and disproportionately over reported. that is worth a discussion