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Original poster

New here, don't kill me

44 replies

ChickensHaveNoEyebrows · 17/08/2011 15:24

Grin

I want to pick your collective brains. What, in your opinion, is the biggest issue that feminism needs to be tackling in the western world? And what do you think needs doing about it?

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HandDivedScallopsrgreat · 17/08/2011 16:32

Sorry Chicken - I mean shift the viewpoint generally of the world away from being looked at through the eyes of men to being more women-centric.

Original poster
ChickensHaveNoEyebrows · 17/08/2011 16:23
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MrsChemist · 17/08/2011 16:22

Victor, there is a thread here in classics that uses that analogy very effectively.

It's a very good thread.

HandDivedScallopsrgreat · 17/08/2011 16:14

Agree that rape and violence against women is the most pressing issue.

Then moving the overton window more in favour of women which would cover things like objectification/attitudes in general/politics and policies.

The second point would be helpful in stopping and prosecuting rape though so it is all interlinked. Rape victims seem to generally have a higher burden of proof than other victims of crime. If a special set of circumstances is adhered to such as they were a virgin prior to the attack, it happened at night (not too late obviously), there were 24 witnesses and the rapist had a neon sign flashing above his head saying "I am a rapist" then conviction may be more of a certainty I may be exaggerating a couple of points for effect.

Original poster
ChickensHaveNoEyebrows · 17/08/2011 16:00

Good point.

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VictorGollancz · 17/08/2011 15:59

No, I really don't think that they are. I don't think that a victim of a burglary is asked if they've ever left their door open before, or if they've ever spoken about their belongings in a busy bar, or if they left a valuable in the window that might tempt a thief. I don't think that if our burglary victim had done all these things, they would seen as deserving to be burgled. Either there's enough evidence to prove the burglar did it, or there isn't.

(Excuse the likening of women to property but it's the clearest analogy I can think of).

Original poster
ChickensHaveNoEyebrows · 17/08/2011 15:53

Victor, but aren't all crimes tried in that way in our justice system? With the prosecution attempting to rubbish the defendents story?

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ThePosieParker · 17/08/2011 15:52

The objectification of women, I think if this is tackled rape and DV would eventually get a knock on.

Original poster
ChickensHaveNoEyebrows · 17/08/2011 15:51

SGM, I've honestly never really considered that before, but it makes complete sense. So, if we put women on an equal footing in this capitalist society (ie. give them decent earning potential), they will be less vulnerable and abusive men will hopefully stop seeing them as dependent possessions to be exploited

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VictorGollancz · 17/08/2011 15:48

Regarding your post about convictions, chickens, I think that the criminal justice system could take a great big step forward by simply believing the victim.

Yes, it often comes down to 'he said she said' but cases could simply be presented in that light, rather than what currently happens which is to start from the position that the victim is lying.

But all too often, these 'he said she said' cases aren't without staggering amounts of 'circumstantial' evidence, in which we see juries willing to believe that it is more likely that two twelve year old girls wanted to have sex with several older men in a public park, than it is that these men simply exploited and raped them. It makes my head hurt.

AliceTwirled · 17/08/2011 15:46

Yay Chickens. You took the plunge Grin

Yep I'd prob say rape and sexual violence culture cos it serves to hold up everything else. It's a broad version of rape and sexual violence, eg in terms of patterns rather than individuals IYSWIM.

The rape myths section here is worth exploring if you're interested. The reasons for non-conviction are complex. I have read stats before (but don't recall where at all) that suggest that corroborating evidence with rape cases is not lower than some other crimes.

StewieGriffinsMom · 17/08/2011 15:44

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
ChickensHaveNoEyebrows · 17/08/2011 15:43

So you think violence against women is rooted in economic inequality?

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StewieGriffinsMom · 17/08/2011 15:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
ChickensHaveNoEyebrows · 17/08/2011 15:39

Abortion rights! Yes! I should have thought of that one. DH is Irish, and there was a huge case about a decade ago where a teenage girl was trying to get to the UK for a termination and was prevented. I remember being horrified.

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VictorGollancz · 17/08/2011 15:36

Yes, rape and DV. And abortion rights. Anything pertaining to the sovereignty of a woman's body. I don't know if they are the biggest per se (I'm sure the uneven distribution of wealth is a similarly gloal issue) but women as a group can't even control and own their own bodies. It's a disgrace.

Original poster
ChickensHaveNoEyebrows · 17/08/2011 15:35

The first thing that came to my mind was the difficulty in achieving convictions for rape. But I haven't a clue what you do about it. So often, there aren't any witnesses. And there might be many reasons why a woman wouldn't have physical injuries as a result of rape

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DontCallMeFrothyDragon · 17/08/2011 15:34

The rape and abuse culture we live in. We need to stop victim blaming, change police attitudes, raise conviction rates and reduce the rates these crimes are carried out. Amongst a million other things.

Welcome, btw. We're not all fire (or froth) breathing dragons, here!

steamedtreaclesponge · 17/08/2011 15:32

Hmm. Probably rape and violence against women, if I HAD to choose. But there are just so many problems! And they all feed into each other...