Have I read this 'story' right?? Please tell me I haven't.

This decision is ghastly on so many levels, as many here have already said.

• It shouldn't matter if a 12 year old child looks 20 or even 30, although that's not likely. In law, they are incapable of giving consent regardless of their appearance or behaviour. The point about the authorities having no sympathy for newsagents who sell alcohol or tobacco to under age kids because they "looked older" is relevant here. The onus is on the adult in both situations to ascertain whether the other person is old enough to legally engage in the activity. Whether it's sex, drinking or smoking, whether the child "wants" to do or is putting pressure on the adult, is totally immaterial.

• I agree that if the children were boys in this case, the outcome would have been VERY different, imho ironically because of a nasty mixture of homophobia and sexism within the criminal justice system (sadly, reflected in society.)

• The fast that most of the perpetrators and the victim were Black is I think significant - that "their" morals and behaviour are different - nasty again.

• The reference to the children being "more sexually experienced than the boys" was totally non sequiter to the case. If a 12 year old child is "sexually experienced," that can only be as the result of previous sexual abuse, full stop. That abuse may have come from within the family or been partly sanctioned by the family, but quite possibly not. In any case, even if the family were complicit (and there is no indication that they were,) surely the criminal justice system has a responsibility to protect vulnerable children - which sexually abused 12 year olds by definition ARE.

Although it's not exactly the same, I'm reminded of the recent case of Hearts Footballer Craig Thompson who was caught engaging in classic "grooming" behaviour online with girls of 12 and 14 (whom he'd known in person since a much younger age) and the fact that his club and at least one high profile sports commentator effectively excused, or at least tried to diminish the gravity of his actions.

I am aghast.

This is why I don't read the papers. I can't take knowing about this stuff. :(

If they were 12. If you are stupid/ reckless/ sick enough to have sex with a 12 year old, then you suffer the legal consequences.

Except you don't. :(

I hope that the girls are getting the help they need to deal with this :(

Maybe the parents are to blame. Did they hold a gun to the young men's heads threatening to shoot if they didn't rape?

And the men had parents who brought them up to think that 6 men taking it in turns to fuck 2 girls (witnesses said that at least some of them thought they were 15) in a park was hunky dory.

Blaming the parents is just another variant of blaming the victim.

There are lots of good reasons for wanting your 12 year old daughter to come straight home after school (so she can get on with her homework, so you can sort out her tea and make sure she's had a decent meal), but the risk of her staying out shouldn't be that she is gang raped in the local park.

No, it was 100% the men's fault and they should b e locked up for a decent length of time, end of.

But the girls parents had a duty of care which they failed to exercise.

They had children who were sexually aware of not active at 12. They had children who were allowed to dress as more mature young women.

" But as someone said: who really cares about some working class black girls getting screwed in the park by some working class black boys...? This makes me so "

Well, their parents clearly didn't.

What a mess.

I credit this case with helping me to really get to grips with the law regarding the age of consent and the SOA in general on this thread.

It is decisions like this where the "I thought she was 16" or "I thought she was consenting" part of a rapist's defence just demonstrates that there is not often much thought involved beyond sticking their cock in a woman.

Sorry, I agree with lisad123.

The whole situation pretty grim but there certainly are 12yos who look 16. The girls instigated the situation. The men were bloody stupid.

They shouldn't get completely get away with this, but there are mitigating factors imo.

And this whole "I couldn't help myself gov, she seduced me" is so fucking Victorian it beggers belief that people are still wheeling it out and getting away with it.
12 year old girls being more sexually experienced than 6 grown men. I'm not one to judge a book but they hardly look as though their wet behind the ears!

Oh for fucks sake! Are we buying that they didn't know they were 12???!!! My step daughter is on facebook and lies about her age to boys (we are dealing with it!) one look at her friends shows them all in school uniform and whilst a couple of them look older, it's clear that they are at the eldest 13 or 14 because of the verying levels of puberty in the friends.
Also, in pictures of just a year or two ago, she looks like a baby - It's the same with all of her friends profiles as well.

These men may not have realised the girls were 12 exactly, bu tthey can't have gone to any lengths to find out how old they actually were and clearly didn't give a fuck. but why would they? Even though the girls were only 12, look what they got, a couple of months prison... hardly a lesson for other s is it?

But as someone said: who really cares about some working class black girls getting screwed in the park by some working class black boys...? This makes me so

Judges are supposed to draw the lines in the sand aren't they Jointhedotties?

The judge here doesn't think it's a big deal?

Why, I wonder.

Who did the raping malinois?

Atomic I think three of them (four if you include the trial judge) have show they are pretty accepting of some working class black girls being raped in a park by some working class black boys.

'After all, they don't really know any better do they? It's not as if they are like us, they're barely better than animals aren't they? Do pass the sherry.'

Sorry, that was probably uncalled for but I'm feeling like I hate the establishment and class structure in this country at the moment. And I'm fucking part of it

Of course this is the same approach they use to people selling fags and booze to people underage. If they say, well I couldn't tell guv, then they're let off. Except no it isn't. Must be cos selling booze and fags underage is just way worse

Because of course the people most accepting of gang rape, you know, those who actually DO it are almost all white, middle aged, middle class and public school educated .

Oh teen gangbangs in parks are totally normal you know Sunshine, I mean it's never happened to me but I've seen loads of films about it. Normal.

Malinos, are you saying that public school educated, Oxbridge, upper middle class, white middle aged men are generally quite acceptant of gang bangs involving 2 x 12 year old girls?

We also need to remember that our senior judges are overwhelmingly public school educated, Oxbridge, upper middle class, white middle aged men. If you want to see what the patriarchy looks like, take a look at our senior judiciary.

Luckily, more and more women are joining the Bar, so we have lots of public school educated, Oxbridge, upper middle class, white, middle aged female judges to look forward to.

I'm sure this will be a huge improvement.

I'm appalled. I'm not sure how any different spin could make it less awful either. Sure, there may be elements we don't know about, but:

6 men, 2 girls. Even if they were 16 there would be something very, very off with this scenario. In what world would it be ok even for two 16-year-olds to have gang-bang sex with 6 lads? Would anyone honestly try to interpret that as done willingly and with no history of abuse? At the age of 16? Really? Plenty of willing teenage sex going on I know, but don't think many of them would be up for a gangbang.

Also, I agree with the other posters who say you can tell that a 12-year-old is underage, even if she looks older. And anyway, what are the odds of both these girls being very advanced for their age? And even if they did look 16 they would still look young enough for any reasonable man to ask about her age and just check.

This is terrible.

They should be in jail IMO. Not a life sentence but they should definately have got a couple of years.

I am sure the fans (even the ones of their own club) will give them a lot of abuse for the rest of their careers.