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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Smear tests to subordinate women

614 replies

sakura · 06/07/2011 04:30

I have been looking at the recent threads about compulsory smear tests in Poland, and I have to say, it doesn'T surprise me that they're compulsory in some countries. THis is a natural, inevitable, progression from the actual purpose of screening.

[Oh, did you think smear tests were about saving women's lives?!?!]

wildkittydear made an excellent point (I hope she doesn't mind me quoting her}
"It is shocking that Poland is thinking of making very personal medical examinations for women compulsory. I personally am very offended by the way only breast and cervical cancer are championed as the only killers of women and I know that is an exaggeration!! but do you get my drift? Some illnesses get priority in the media and I am not convinced there is always a benign reason for this."

Yes, Womanhood is the "problem" to be cured. Women's organs that are seen as faulty-- because men don't have them. Not male = pathology.

The truth is that women's bodies are much, much healthier than men's because we have two Xs in our chromozomal make up and each X contains lots of life-preserving genes, whereas the Y is slightly pitiful by comparison.
This is why women live longer and why boys are more like to be born with chromozomal abnormalities or die when they get sick. Girls tend to recover.
The extra X gives women the biological upper hand.

Men don't really know how to look after their bodies either, in a general sense (healthy diet etc)

Considering this, it's really important to question why the medical fraternity is obsessed with getting women to their tests and not men. Men are more likely to contract all sorts of diseases and cancers, and much earlier in their life than women too.

But men are trusted to look after their own bodies and decide for themselves whether they want to be screened or not. There is no goverment promoted mass-screening programme of testicular cancer, for example. BEcause testicles belong to men, and are therefore regarded as "healthy until proven otherwize"Men are not frightened, coerced or cajolled into being screened because there is no obsession with controlling them.

THe history of medicine teaches us that women, and by default their sex specific organs, are regarded as defective and pathalogical. (when if any sex is defective, it is the male sex due to the Y, which renders them biologicaly more vulnerable to disease in a number of ways)

Greer has covered this in detail in The Whole Woman. She has examined the evidence which shows that cervical screening has done nothing to save women's lives.
Women are still dying from cervical cancer. Although the rate of cervical cancer has been dropping , that is not because of screening, but because because it was actually dropping naturally before mass screening was invented, and continues to drop at the same rate.

Often mistakes are made in the laboratories, and there have been cases of women who actually had healthy cervixes being treated for cancer, and women who had cancer were missed, and ended up dying.

As I said, the point is not to actually save women's lives, but to get women to comply, to STFU and to be penetrated by gynelogical instruments.I don'T get screened, because I've looked at the statistics and found that, despite screening, women are still dying of cervical cancer so the margin for human error in the tests is too great.

Which brings me to another important question. WTF are men doing in gynecology anyway? I mean, WhyTF are they even there? In the room? Sticking bits of metal into women? Researching vaginas, when it's not their place to do so? THe funding should go to female scientists and doctors [but that's for another thread]

I haven't had a smear test for over ten years. WHen I had my first at 18 the results came back telling me I needed to go for a re-test for possible cancerous cells. I went back, had another check, the second time it came back clear (after me scaring myself to death). After doing research I learned that if you have had sperm or even your period (if you'd just finished it) can interfere with the findings, making it look as though there may be cancerous cells when there aren't.

WHat a joke. And the joke's on women. And I haven't been back since.

OP posts:
winnybella · 06/07/2011 22:15

Right, so men choose to be gynecologists to exert power over women. Hmm Few, perhaps.

Seriously, instead of being glad that we have means of preventing of cervical cancer, some people on here come up with patriachal conspiracies.

Male and femal reproductive systems are not the same. One poster has explained how prostate cancer usually attacks older men and usually grows slowly. Men over certain age are expected to get their prostates tested. Cervical cancer attacks younger women as well, therefore it makes sense to have regular screening program in place. Even if there is a small percentage of false positives/negatives.

It's just common sense.

LeninGrad · 06/07/2011 22:07

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Chipotle · 06/07/2011 22:01

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IWouldNotCouldNotWithAGoat · 06/07/2011 21:55

Alice: Point taken, but I'm not sure that makes the premise any less bonkers!

nenevomito · 06/07/2011 21:52

I'm really thinking about it now. Would I be comfortable. Hmmm. Not at all sure.

Sidge · 06/07/2011 21:51

LeninGrad it's making sure you sample the TZ around the cervical os that would be the most difficult part. It's a bit more precise than sticking the brush up there and wiggling it around (but I can appreciate if you've had awful smears it is tempting to do your own.)

Hullygully · 06/07/2011 21:51

It may have been something like there was less competition because it wasn't glam like heart ops etc. That would figure.

Hullygully · 06/07/2011 21:50

No, I odn't think that Goat either. I had one bad experience and it has left me wary (like everyone about everything once bitten etc). Someone medical once told me something v interesting about why men choose gynaecology ie for what professional reasons, but sadly I have forgot it

AliceTwirled · 06/07/2011 21:50

IWouldNotCouldNotWithAGoat - the point wasn't about sexual gratification. It comes from the same place as thinking that rape is about power rather than sexual gratification.

Hullygully · 06/07/2011 21:48

yeah but no but. I dunno.

IWouldNotCouldNotWithAGoat · 06/07/2011 21:48

I am not disputing that there are some pervy/dodgy gynos. I am disputing that the profession exists so that they can get sexual gratification from poking people with a speculum.

LeninGrad · 06/07/2011 21:46

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Hullygully · 06/07/2011 21:45

I agree that the way I feel isn't fair, it's quite a strong feeling tho of not wanting stranger men dabbling with my bits. I don't know what the answer is.

LeninGrad · 06/07/2011 21:44

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AliceTwirled · 06/07/2011 21:43

Here

It's not the same test as a smear. But is for the same purpose.

HerBeX · 06/07/2011 21:40

how d'you get it analysed afterwards?

Am v. curious about these DIY kits, do they really exist? Surely not?

nenevomito · 06/07/2011 21:38

I've just realised reading through the thread that I've never had a smear done by a man. I've never considered whether I would have one or not and its moot as our local GP uses female nurses.

I do agree with surelynottrue that suggesting men may become gynaes for nefarius reasons is akin to questioning why men may work with children. I wouldn't question a woman becoming a proctologist.

I had a male midwife which didn't bother me.

Sidge · 06/07/2011 21:35

rainbowtoenails "Smear tests are something women can do themselves with DIY kits"

You really think so?

So you reckon you can use a speculum to open your own vagina, visualise your cervical os, insert a brush and rotate it 5 times clockwise ensuring you have sampled the Transformation Zone fully?

Wow if so you should be in the circus. You must be very flexible!

surelynottrue · 06/07/2011 21:18

This view of why would men even want to work with vagina's they must be up to something is kind of similar to the why would men want to work with children comments.

There will be bad doctors regardless of gender earlier in this thread 2 women posted bad experiences they had with female gyno's does that mean all female gyno's will be bad? Nowadays male doctors have a female nurse present so that they are protected.

LeninGrad · 06/07/2011 21:13

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rainbowtoenails · 06/07/2011 20:55

Iwouldnot- actually the man in the link I earlier referred to specifically sought out a practice in a halls of residence in order to target young vulnerable women to abuse. Not all doctors are saints, some get into medicine because they are sick perverts who get off on their position of power.

rainbowtoenails · 06/07/2011 20:52

schrodingers- I'm sure there will be a statistic somewhere that shows that men are much more likely than women doctors to abuse their position. This man was a total mysogynist, he even referred to his victims as 'bitches', what do you think the odds are of a woman being like this? 1 in a million, 1 in 10 million, 1 in 100 million? He was creepy in a way I cant imagine a woman ever being.

HerBeX · 06/07/2011 20:48

Glad you're enjoying the feminism section Goat. Grin

HerBeX · 06/07/2011 20:47

I have a friend who when confronted by a young, good looking gynaecologist imperiously demanded that he be sent away and replaced with an old, ugly one.

The hospital actually acceded to her demand. Grin