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Original poster

being a sah is not considered a legitimate pursuit anymore...

189 replies

AliGrylls · 02/07/2011 10:29

I am fed up of people thinking that being a SAHP is the easy option - I am a firm believer it is not an easy option. Most SAHM I know have what I would describe as quite a rough time of it. Hubbie leaving the house at 6/7 am; not getting home until 7/8 and woman is expected to do all the jobs she was expected to do 40/50 years ago, ie, washing, ironing etc - except for the fact that DH wants the children to be kept up so he can play with them and say what a good father he is.

The whole notion that being a working parent is so much harder is not true because while you are out working there is someone else looking after your children for you. You are not trying to do them both simultaneously. What is hard is trying to fit a job around your children, which is what most women want so they can enjoy their lives and their children (I think!)

A woman who chooses to SAH after children start school is not lazy, she is merely trying to redress the fact that she has spent the first few years of her children's life knee deep in nappies and sleep deprived having worked the 17 hour day that was expected of her. When her children start school she will probably be back to working 8-10 hour days that most people work.

Lastly, there is actually no shame in being a SAHP and it can be fulfilling and stimulating. It is just a question of whether one wants to treat is a proper job or a millstone around the neck. Is a job really that much more intellectually stimulating? Surely, after a few years any job loses its ability to stimulate due to the fact it becomes a process? Unless of course you are in academia or a creative job. Except for financial reasons the main reason to go back to work is to have a break from the children / have a career. Neither of which are bad reasons just please admit that this is the reason and not use the fact that you obviously believe you have the intellectual high ground over someone who chooses to SAH.

I strongly believe the above is a feminist issue and I think that being a SAH deserves the same level of respect that being a working parent gets, but it doesn't. Feminists please back up the fact that a woman has a right to choose and she should not be guilted into the modern day notion that working is all and being a full-time mother is not a legitimate pursuit.

OP posts:
SarahLundsredJumper · 03/07/2011 00:18

I would never give up my job kalo I worked my guts out to get where I am and as I have said before I truly believe I do a job that benefits the lives of others.
I have repeatedly said I didnt have to use childcare but I dont believe that parents who do use childcare disadvantage them by doing so< bangs head against wall and wonders why she is bothering>

kalo12 · 03/07/2011 00:11

yes, you choose to work and you are happy because you don't have to disadvantage your children by doing so.

the point i am making is that for many working parents it is not working which is difficult but finding child care that you are happy with can be difficult. If money is no object then you don not have such a difficult decision because you could give up your work if your childcare was not what you wanted.

SarahLundsredJumper · 03/07/2011 00:05

Er- No I am not choosing to misunderstand you .
You seem to be assuming that parents who work dont have a choice unless they are "slebs" -I choose to work .
Because I love my job ,it is very fulfilling and I earn approx 40K-which means I and my family have a comfortable lifestyle and I can plan for my DC future security.
If my DP had not been able to work flexibly i would have chosen the best childcare I could afford.
To be a permanent Sahm would not have been an option for me.

kalo12 · 02/07/2011 23:49

yes sarah, i agree, are you deliberately misundersatnding me. Most parents do find the best possible childcare, because they don't have another option - ie to be with their child and not work, sleb mums do have a choice however, if they find that they miss their kids too much or are unhappy with their child care arrangements they can give up their work.
The point I am trying to make is that most parents would like the luxury of not having to put their child in child care, but it is a luxury. And faced with that situation have to find the best possible childcare.

I could not do this either, so i decided to sell my house, move to rented tiny flat and share the childcare with my dh. But it is a massive sacrifice, to sell your house (for a loss, I might add), and go back to work full time when i didn't want to just because i earnt more than dh

twinklypearls · 02/07/2011 23:45

I think being a SAHP is a much respected role in society and certainly a legitimate one. I would love with all my heart to be a SAHP, infact one of the few things that causes tension between dp and I is the fact that he does not earn enough for us to have more children and for me to become a SAHP.

I do not think it is harder than being a WOHM, certainly in my case anyway. However this is a good thing, working yourself to exhaustion is not a virtue.

Again in my case I do not do everything that a SAHP would do and then work as well, my home is run much better during the holidays when I live out my SAHM fantasies.

SarahLundsredJumper · 02/07/2011 23:41

I think that whether parents SAH or WOH they are still bringing up their children .
I doubt many parents think -Oh Im sure a childminder is better than me -I doubt if I had needed childcare(I didnt) a childminder would have been my first choice anyway.
The point I am trying to make is that parents mostly go to great lengths to find kind,caring and loving childcare.

kalo12 · 02/07/2011 23:31

i didn't day inadequate I said less adequate. Many parents do infact think they would do a better job of bringing up their children than their childminders but cannot afford it, so they make the best possible choice. I would say that most people who choose to use child care do so for financial reasons not because they believe child minders would do a better job than themselves, and certainly if this were true CMs would cost more than 10 pounds per hour!

Indigojohn · 02/07/2011 23:28

I agree Sarah.
My kids nursery was just fantastic. Far from inadequate!

SarahLundsredJumper · 02/07/2011 23:24

BTW My DC have never been in childcare -my DP and I have very flexible jobs and so we shared their care. BUT I really do think that parents choose and are very careful in their choice of childcare-they want their DC to be happy and well cared for.

SarahLundsredJumper · 02/07/2011 23:21

Why would you choose to entrust your child to someone who is inadequate ?? Most parents choose the very best they can find .

Wafflepuss · 02/07/2011 23:13

There is certainly no shame in being a SAHP, but no way it is as hard as being a working parent. I know several SAHP of school age children and their days are definately not hard work. All power to them, but they are the first to agree that our friends who work and have children have a much harder life than they do.

kalo12 · 02/07/2011 23:13

aligrylls - wholeheartedly agree with you. and furthermore bringing up children is one of the most important and beneficial jobs for soceity, much more important than running a bank, for instance. And the skills needed, skills such as tolerance, patience, flexibility, multi tasking, communication are much more prized and useful skills than power, control, strength.

What pisses me off is sleb mums who say they understand about being a working mum, VB, Mylene, gwyneth etc. They don't have to make a choice or a sacrifice between working and not being able to bring up their children, they can afford not to work, they work for fun, knowing that they can give it up if they are concerned about their children's well being. Going to work is not difficult, even in my very stressful job, but entrusting the care of your child to soemone less adequate than yourself is heart breaking.

SarahLundsredJumper · 02/07/2011 23:09

Hhahahaha very true - probably twentys thoughWink

Indigojohn · 02/07/2011 23:07

Aw Sarah - they are a full time job and the smell, best in the world!

DH says I just feed them tenners, though.

SarahLundsredJumper · 02/07/2011 23:05

I had horses Indigo - a looong time ago - they are a full time jobGrin
I lost my last lovely boy in very sad circumstances and I just cant put myself through that loss again Sad
love horses love their smell but I make do with cats these days Grin

Indigojohn · 02/07/2011 22:59

Good post Sarah - quite.

Whatever makes you and your family happy .

BTW, doing the horses is pretty full time, I just don't make any money doing it!

SarahLundsredJumper · 02/07/2011 22:57

I would love to have horses,land and a big house -I dontGrin
But I do have a lovely DP and 2 gorgeous DC and a job I love -we are all different.
I think OP you need to work on your self esteem. I had 2 years of mat leave and worked very partime when my DC were little but now I would be very bored if I was still at home . I work in healthcare and am passionate about what I do and the difference I make to the lives of others. If I say I love my job and I say I would be unstimulated at home I am talking about myself not casting aspertions about you .

Indigojohn · 02/07/2011 20:12

I couldn't give a shiny shit what others think of my lifestyle, really I couldn't.

I don't work, haven't for donkey's, won't again. I have a fair number of kids, big house, horses, land etc to maintain and parents who like me nearby and a DH who earns the kind of money that me working would render ludicrous.

Why on EARTH would I care what others think? Hmm

pinkthechaffinch · 02/07/2011 19:51

Thanks for this thread

I catch myself saying 'I'm just a SAHM at the moment' when meeting new people and it's so wrong and for some reason I feel the need to say it's just until dd reaches school age when actually I'd love to continue being a SAHM until both dcs leave home!

Original poster
AliGrylls · 02/07/2011 19:47

Completely agree with you joanhina. I think you have summed up my view of feminism in two sentences.

OP posts:
Original poster
AliGrylls · 02/07/2011 19:45

riven, your point about how feminists see staying at home as letting the side down is also what I am getting at (as per my last paragraph). I have not gone on about this so much but I do consider that my antecedents, aside from fighting for the right to vote, also fought for the right for women to choose between SAH and working mothers.

OP posts:
Original poster
AliGrylls · 02/07/2011 19:34

sm, I would not say I have a chip on my shoulder about anything. I love being a SAHM and I find it really rewarding. However, just recently I have found myself biting my tongue though when I have heard people (usually working mums) saying things like being at home is: a) not stimulating (I think it is if you make it and are thoughtful in how you teach your children); b) so much easier than working. Maybe in some ways it is easier, but if I was working I would be paying for someone to look after my children and it would be a full-time job, therefore being a SAHP is by definition a full-time job.

Also, I do think being a SAHP more is expected. Not so much DH (because he is sympathetic) but my mum frequently asks me about what jobs I have done in a day and I have heard friends saying things like "DH will be cross because the house is so chaotic". Of my friends who SAH, I know of some men who basically don't expect to have to do anything when they come home (one friend even told me that her DH had said if she wanted to go away for the weekend she had to arrange childcare - how ridiculous is that).

All I think is that being a SAHP does not get any respect. And also I am fed up of people saying to me - "I couldn't SAH, I wouldn't find it stimulating". To me it is equivalent to the orphanage insult.

OP posts:
joaninha · 02/07/2011 19:13

juggling - thanks :)

The second issue is hugely frustrating I know! I always remember having a bit of a feminist awakening when I was in a History lesson at school. After having learnt the dates and details of yet another invention I piped up with the question: "what did women do then?" The teacher looked at me all apologetically and said "I'm sorry to say it but they just looked after the children".

That statement told me all I needed to know about the status of women in history, whose work was valued and whose not. I guess it never occurred to him to do a bit of research, whip out a weaving loom and some scary factoids on the perils of childbirth. It would have been a helluva lot more interesting to me than the interminable list of battles that we had to endure!.

jugglingwiththreeshoes · 02/07/2011 18:20

joaninha That's a great summary of what feminism should/could be.
Maybe so far it's made more strides in the first arena though.
Perhaps there's still a lot more to do on changing attitudes around traditional women's roles ?

joaninha · 02/07/2011 17:47

IMO Feminism is a two-pronged attack. It aims to

  1. increase the diversity of opportunities for women and girls so they have REAL choice (not just legal choice) to do what they want with their lives.

  2. increase the profile and respect due to what is regarded as "traditional" women's work, eg. being a SAHM, nurse, primary school teacher, dressmaker etc and erase this stupid notion that women have not contributed to society in the same way as men.

And that's why I heart Fsm - it's just common sense..