Was Bristol Palin raped?

"There are other ways to enhance the status of your gender than screaming I am a feminist - especially when you use that as a stick with which to put down others - gender irrespective."

Oh thanks for that, I hadn't realised

I had regular sex with my older boyfriend when I was 15 too. He was an abusive arse. What are we trying to prove here? Pulling out anecdotes is meaningless.

I think everyone should have a chance too. But being blind to gender politics does not do that. We do not live in a utopia where people are blind to gender. People's actions need to be contextualised within the world that actually exists, and that is a sexist one.

BTW...I thought you might have gone off elsewhere.

reelingintheyears Sat 25-Jun-11 18:32:32
Only just got here having read through the later stuff.

But you did imply that that statement meant you can't take her seriously.

Dittany,can i ask you a genuine question?

Do you think families do need fathers?

And i'm not looking for reasons why they don't but reasons you might think that they do.

Sorry to CP this but would you tell me your thoughts on this?

I also had regular sex with my boyfriend at 15. It was a really positive relationship which I don't regret. It wasn't rape. Some 15yr olds are ready, some aren't. The age of consent protects those who aren't.

I shagged when i was fifteen.

I wasn't raped either.

Nor was i drunk.

reeling - it's the point buzzsore made though - that at crucial points in enquiries about abusive conduct, females tend to have to have a higher quality of 'evidence' before they are 'believed'. So the stronger assumptions are indeed that 'she is making it up'.

I have no idea if BP was raped, and agree witn Snorbs - you can be really drunk and give consent, and then wake up and be unable to recall events, never mind if you gave someone the nod.

She was 15, he was 16 at the time.

They were in Alaska, where statutory rape requires a 3 year age gap.

buzzsore - Agree absolutely 100%

Stating that women should be believed if they say they are abused or coerced for raped is exactly right. It is misogynistic that they are scrutinised harder and changing that is the only way in which the dreadful conviction rate for rapes and sexual assaults will ever improve.

However, it doesn't logically follow that saying that a teenager is capable of lying is misogynistic IYSWIM and thats the bit that I find difficult.

AS FAR AS I UNDERSTAND from this thread - i haven't got any other facts .;. Bristol was 15.

she was 15

was she 15?

is it 15 years old she was

fifteen

one and five - fifteen

i dont give a flying fuck if she was butt naked bouncing on the bed - sober as a judge and screaming - fuck me fuck me fuck me

she was 15

i#m not seeing how anyone can argue this?

I would never assume that the women or girls were lying.

But i would also not assume that the men or boys were lying either.

That would not be fair.

So you lied to cover up the abuse. Yes this has been reported by several people on this thread (including me). That makes sense.

But that doesn't mean we should then assume women and girls are lying when they are reporting abuse. Quite the opposite.

But what's misogynistic is that it's the women and girls' version of events which is always scrutinised harder.

It's well-known that women fail to report sexual abuse/rape because they fear they won't be believed, and that doesn't come out of nowhere.

Jesus all this uproar just because it's been pointed out that calling Bristol Palin a liar is misogynistic and insisting that teenage girls lie is also misogynistic.

Taking the first part of that statement - The discussion wasn't that Bristol Pailin lied, it was that she might have lied as she was put in an absolutely appalling position by her own mother. Its a valid point.

The second bit is a nonsense. I have a teenage girl and she can lie through her teeth! Saying that isn't misogynistic. In fact I'd suggest that the suggestion that a teenage girl can't do something as basic as lying is misogynistic.

Just a thought.

Ok.....Do children need their Fathers?

Easy enough.

again FWIW, asking if 'families need fathers' is a difficult one to answer. The expereince of families is specific and individual.

I think It's absolutely ok to raise matters that another poster have themselves raised on other threads - it aids a consistency in debate. I had skimmed the FS just now and noticed dadof2 was happy to declare himself a feminist, whilst also stating he fails to see how pronography is an objectification. ( wasn't helped by being previously banned I understand, which I think is a well-resreved sanction).

FWIW I would also be careful about the org. FNF, as it declares an interest in maintaining 'second parent contact' and equality of legal status, with no qualifying conditions. If I were to be an abusive chap then I would be attracted to such an org. ( not indicating ALL users are abusive, obv.).