Magdalene laundries

5dollarshake my mum is also irish catholic and is sooo very defensive of it. there is no room for debate with her. it just isn't open for discussion and I hate to say it because she is an intelligent, succesful woman but her blind following of this religion really has me dumbfounded. i really dont understand her logic. but then a part of me thinks, it is nothing to do with logic, she was brought up in this religion and it was instilled in her to fear the priest and the nuns (at school) she has told me how 'wicked' the nuns were to her and her classmates. she talks of some of them now and it is very clear she has no love for any of them, no respect for any of them yet she still goes to mass every week, refuses to miss it and regularly tells us (non-believers) we are heathens.

The Caholic Church absolutely terrifies me - I would love for a rational, articulate, non-hysterical Catholic to come onto this thread and explain the MLs in a way that I could get my head around but I don't think it is possible in a million years. Suncottage - that is just hideous what your mother went through.

DH is Irish Catholic, and it is instilled him - as much a part of his culture and heritage as Irish music and the craic. We can no longer discuss the topic because we disagree so vehemently. He is only a Christenings-weddings-and-funerals church-goer, but it makes no difference - he won't take any criticism of it. I do believe that a lot of it is pure defensiveness - as much as actively supporting or agreeing with them - since I am so anti and I think he feels compelled to speak out in support.

Our children are Christened into the Catholic church and I HATE it. I agreed because it was so important to him, and on the condition that they NEVER go to a Catholic school. I am the antithesis of all those mothers who pretend to be religious to get their kids into a Catholic school; I would do anything to keep my Catholic-Christened children out of one. The thought of my daughter - and my son - being raised to believe their insidious ideas makes me want to cry. :(

Booy sorry am still crp at links but it is top search on youtube for magdalene launderies cork

TheCrackFox

No she has never had therapy, she is now in her eighties but I am fiercely protective of her. She always tries to 'buy' friendships and so many people reject her because she can come across as being needy and wanting to be liked.

As a child and a teenager I was frequently embarassed by her behaviour. She had no idea how to be a 'mum'. Now I understand what she went through at the hands of the church. It was a dehumanising exercise in every respect and I had a glimpse of it with her treatment of me.

It does go down through the generations. I once went to visit a [catholic] friend in Dublin where she proudly pointed out the park where 'a million people turned out to see the Pope.'

I would cross the road to see him if he was to apologise to my mother about the abuse she went through as a helpless baby and child at the hands of nuns and priests.

"Week after week, the faithful occupy the pews"

To be fair to all the still practicing Catholics the thought of languishing in hell for eternity is quite a strong motivator.

In one orphanage in Belfast, the nuns dealt with bed wetting by making the child bathe in a solution of Jeyes fluid and scrubbing their genitals with wire brushes. Nuns and priests seem to have competed with each other for savagery towards children
Some of the accounts submitted to the Ryan Report were so horrific they were not revealed.
It is true that the Laundries were not confined to Ireland (there was at least one in Australia) but, as with other institutions run by the RC church, they were totally unaccountable there as De Valera had given the church the mandate for formulating social policy- in a word, the law.
For all that, it seems that few turned their backs on the church.
Week after week, the faithful occupy the pews.

Suncottage, sorry to hear about your mother's terrible childhood. It must have been horrific for her and by extension very upsetting for you.

Has she ever had any therapy to help her deal with her experiences or has she just tried to muddle through in life?

What I find hard is that Jesus (I don't actually believe in him) was supposed to be all about love, acceptance and forgiveness but the Catholic Church seems to be able to ignore his message so easily.

I have posted that my mother was a 'Magdalene' girl and believe me the orphanages were not confined to Ireland.

My mother came out traumatised and when she had children of her own she had no idea how to be a 'mother'.

She is now very elderly and frail but still 'hides' things all around the house in weird places.
I find it so upsetting that when she talks about her 'childhood' to strangers who have a purient interest, she pretends it was all lovely.

Hearing her stories as a child was just horrifying. Girls being held down and having their hair cut to the scalp with shears by the priest in front of the whole school because 'she considered herself pretty' and being made to stand outside in a snowstorm wearing a nightgown to 'teach them compliance' for hours because they spoke at bedtime.

Bastards. That is just two mild examples of what she went through.

Scarlettsmummy, I hsd the exact same reaction to the film. I'm sensitive as it is, but that shocked me to the core. To then hear it was "mild" compared to what people went through is absolutely heartbreaking.

I have also seen the "magdalene sisters' film. I think I cried from start to finish, but what shocked me the most is that the last laundry was only closed in 1996. Shocking.

ninah, do you have a link to that vid? tehre seem to be quite a few on YT.

TheCrackFox
They changed her name?

The Catholic Church (I was brought up a Catholic) actively hates women and is one of the biggest reasons that I am a Feminist.

Me too!

stealthpicasso, apologies

and for a strangely moving video see steathpicasso's short film on youtube of the derilict ML at cork

my grandmother was orphaned young enough to be brought up my nuns. She was supposed to stay with them until age 21 at which time they put pressure on her to find a vocation; she had an offer of work as an au pair which she wanted to take up. Eventually she did so; some time afterwards when she needed a passport she found out she was actually a couple of years older than she had believed herself to be, because they'd lied about her age to keep her there as long as possible.

Blair has a lot to feel guilty about, no wonder Catholicism suits him. I'll try and unearth the Hitchens debate, thanks for telling me about it.

AlouiseG,

And what about her husband who converted. What was that all about?

Somewhere on the internet, there is a debate between Blair and atheist Christopher Hitchins which makes for good viewing. Blair doesn't fare so well.

I'd love to have half an hour with a bunch of Catholic hand wringers. Especially the professional victims who chose to convert to such a vile regime.

Yes Cherie "human rights" Blair, I'm looking at you!

I see quite a lot of women claiming to be catholics and talking about how they feel guilt . Some of them wear it like a badge. At least until they've got their kids into the school they want, anyway.

I never know whether to laugh or cry when posters talk about getting their kids into a catholic school and how great it is. Yep, fucking fantastic to instill fear, sexual repression and guilt into your kids, nice one.

"Watch the congregation exit from a RC church and note which gender predominates- with the children in tow."

the members of society who had most to fear, were more vulnerable, easier to control. this mindset has carried on and been instilled into newer generations so it doesn't surprise me in teh slightest that teh majority of RC church goers are female and/or children.

Remember the child migrant scandal in Britain. It went on for about 50 years. Lots of officials must have known about it.

www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/film/film-news/8014953/Oranges-and-Sunshine-Emily-Watson-stars-in-child-migrant-scandal-film.html

Makes you wonder if similar things are still going on, and in another 50 years time, we find out about it.

i think it must have been down to the catholic church's influence over society. particularly ireland 50/60/70 years ago. the church was basically law. doctors, mayors, charities etc must have felt they had nowhere to go. what would the 'real' law have done anway? especially considering that there definitely weren't any women in charge then.

How anybody can stay loyal to the Catholic church knowing what they were responsible for is beyond me. As an institution it should be banned from this and any other country.

Hitchins and Dawkins, amongst others had planned to have the pope arrested for crimes against humanity when he visited but, sadly, it didn't happen.
The Magdalene Laundries were run by nuns-women and they were responsible for the cruelty. The fact that the male priesthood could have spoken up and done something, does not absolve them one bit. If i remember correctly, the last one closed down in the mid 90's; not because of humanitarian concerns, but because the universal availability of washing machines meant they were no longer financially viable.
Of the women featured in the film, how many turned their backs on the church?
I'd like to see some figures on attendance but, in my experience, it is women who attend mass, insist on having children baptised etc. I don't believe the institution would survive without the mindless compliance of the female faithful. Watch the congregation exit from a RC church and note which gender predominates- with the children in tow.
I agree that it is a contemptible and criminal institution. Setting aside the M.Laundries, imagine any other institution responsible for endemic physical and sexual abuse of children being allowed to exist. It is unthinkable.

It's like some sort of science fiction story, where the whole society was to blame.