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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Childcare and the tax system - fascinating thread title! - but I'm genuinely interested

130 replies

SardineQueen · 02/06/2011 11:46

I've recently become self employed and have found that I can deduct pretty much anything to do with my work from my tax bill, bar childcare costs. Given that childcare is pretty much a fundamental to working, if you have children, easily as much so as petrol or car insurance or a printer cartridge or whatever it might be, why is it not allowed as a business cost? (Sorry if have the jargon wrong).

This is also linked to what I thought at the time of the MP expense scandals. They were claiming legitimately for all sorts of things - cars houses duck houses decorating you name it. There was a female MP though who got told off for claiming for her nanny. Claiming for her cleaner, or gardener would have been fine. But not the nanny, and no-one in the papers seemed to question this rule. Surely in terms of enabling a woman to work (or enabling both parents to work if we want to put it properly!!!), a nanny or other childcare is absolutely essential. But it's not allowed.

Does anyone know WHY?

My guess is tradition, systems being set up to serve men, and possibly expense.

Has anyone ever questioned these rules, and if so does anyone know what the official response is? Because when you look at it without the filter of current practice on, it is totally illogical. It makes no sense.

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SardineQueen · 02/06/2011 14:49

Also agree that high quality state funded childcare for those who want it is the holy grail of this subject area.

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SardineQueen · 02/06/2011 14:47

Suzi Grin I'm fairly sure it will never happen, but pleased to see that your idea of why it is set up like this in the first place tallies with mine! I'm not sure how it would work in practice but it wouldn't be that difficult I don't think. At the moment eg I know my dad claimed a proportion of the household bills for his work from home and it could quite easily fit into that.

suchprospects I was thinking about the higher rate taxpayer thing on the way round the shops Grin Everyone got in a lather about it with childcare vouchers I know. But (and speaking here as a bit of a a lefty) why should that be? If the idea is that you are allowed to pay for childcare out of your pre-tax income then that just makes sense. If you are self-employed presumably the things that you offset benefit you more if you are HRT in the same way but no-one is having a coronary about that. In a way I think I'd be pretty happy to ignore that inequality if it meant that childcare could be counted as a valid business expense / taken from pre tax earnings across the board. The way to look at it surely is that the less well off and the more well off all gain the same in terms of how their childcare costs are treated. Some gain some, some gain more. If the alternative is that childcare is not deductible then everyone loses IYSWIM.

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SuchProspects · 02/06/2011 13:37

On the expenses scandal - the logic is to do with "needing" to keep a second home because of the need to live in both their constituency and London. Most of the "legitimate" expenses are in regard to keeping the second home. Gardeners etc. could not be claimed for the MP's primary residence that they theoretically would need to maintain regardless of their job. A nanny is not an expense linked to keeping a second home so not considered equivalent to a gardener by the rules.

Generally I would agree with childcare being deductible except I think it would result in a net gain by those who are already well-off and consequently a loss for those less well-off. Would prefer to see sufficient high quality state funded care available for everyone who wanted it instead.

suzikettles · 02/06/2011 11:56

Interesting.

Fundamentally, I suspect it's because men had wives to do that job and no-one ever thought of it being any different.

In practice, how would you see it working? If you had a partner who was also earning (but not self employed) would you claim half your childcare expenses - as half would be your partners? Would it need to be tied into OFSTED registration to stop people "paying" their mothers/partners for looking after the children?

There's no way it'll happen in the short term as the present government seem to be determined to remove the only childcare tax break there is (in the form of vouchers) - and of course the self-employed could never claim those anyway (which was disgraceful).

SardineQueen · 02/06/2011 11:48

I'm going out for a bit now Smile but will be back later to peruse!

This question is pretty fundamental actually, I think.

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