Feminist Parenting of Boys MAY Bookclub: Jenni Murray's "That's My Boy!"

It's difficult - just reading the Amazon precis of most those on the list above was irritating, they seem to be mostly based on the 'boys brains are different' premise.

The exception is presumably Pink Brain blue brain, but I wonder whether it has anything new over and above Delusions of Gender?

Has anyone read both and if so is PB BB worth a read?

Sorry I missed the chat - I wasn't able to get hold of the book. Hope to join in next time and have enjoyed reading the comments about this one.

mad I can't remember now what I asked - maybe something about whether she'd got any buy-in from any politicians...

blackcurrants sorry you missed it too. And w/r/t toxic childhood something with a more feminist slant prob better for next read.

sue palmer (toxic childhood and 21st c boys) did an mn webchat 17 mar 10. she had a couple of interesting things to say (re the mn campaign about sexualisation of girls - there should also be one against the brutalisation of boys) but seems to be quite a fan of steve biddulph.

Toxic Childhood v useful read

'night all

I've read toxic childhood. really liked it until the chapter which slags off single mothers, was so pissed off I refused to read the rest of it!

What are other suggestions for the next book. I think someone suggested Pink Brain, Blue Brain. Amazon suggested:

growing great boys

Playful parenting

Raising Cain

Raising sons this looks Biddulphesque and irritating

raising boys without men

Bringing up boys Again Bidduplhesque?.

21st century boys reviews say harsh on feminists.

The cleverness of boys

Toxic Childhood

Anyone got any opinions or recommendations on any of these?

Hee hee ! Yeah, I wasn't taken over with quite the same violent urges as you - but parts like that were definitely annoying! But sometimes I think that some feminist authors are so afraid to seem anti-male that they overcompensate with slightly wacky theories. Or maybe that is my wacky theory!

Have to go to beddie byes now - early start - nice to chat to you all - would love to do Delusions of Gender next if anyone was up for it - as that was a cracker of a book..

tougholdbird - don't be hard on yourself - my guess is you were just doing that because you were frustrated at DH's refusal to pick up smelly socks and making a joke out of it is preferable to nagging him every other minute of the day. That certainly was the way for me and ex-DH (but don't worry it wasn't the smelly socks that did us in!)

oooh you should read "Shattered: Modern Motherhood and the illusion of equality" by Rebecca Asher (also from Woman's Hour) as she has quite a bit on that dilemma (although she also criticizes Mumsnet - sacrilege!!).

darleneoconnor - don't lose heart - you haven't got to the "Schoolboys" chapter yet - she really gives Biddy old Biddulph one in the eye there ...

(love your name btw - she was my role model when I was a grungy teen!)

joaninha I hadn't realised what a standing family joke I'd been making about DH's inability to do basic domestic stuff and how by doing so, I was giving out a clear message that he couldn't help it cos he was a man. Then I'd expect my DS to somehow not apply this excuse to himself!

I found the 'Bully Boys' and 'Schoolboys' chapters to be most interesting. The first is about challenging the aggressive and macho stereotypes and the second is about boys (and girls) in the educational system (where she tackles the 'feminising of education' and challenges the idea that girls are doing so well and better than boys). The first few chapters were definitely weaker and a little disjointed, but I did think there were still things to be learnt there.

Jenni Murray doesnt think much of Biddulph and I particularly enjoyed her attack on him on pages 168-9. I don't think I could read his book-that way lies a coronary I think.

Hello tougholdbird! I'm with you re. the denigrating mantalk - a few years ago I was having a big gossipfest re. dating with one of my friends who'd been dumped and we were about to do our usual moaning about boyfriends, ex-boyfriends, the whole shebang, I could feel it was going down the "why do men always do that?" route. (In this instance it was why do men get spooked if you, like, text them more than once a day?!!)

DS was nearby doing his thing where he pretends not to listen (but then recites entire conversation word for word 2 weeks later!) and I really had to stop myself with super-human strength and since then have (almost successfully!) banned any statements that begin with "Men are...." or "Women are ..."!! So tough ....

Hi,
I've only managed to get as far as 'boys dont cry' but I'm not exactly warming to the tone of the book. Maybe it changes in later chapters but it is a poor comparison to DoG. maybe a sign of the changing times over the last few years?

As a mother of both genders I dont think JM would have wrote this book if she'd had a girl in addition to her 2 boys. The book seems to be her way of alleviating her 'feminist gulit' over feeling pride at having 2 boys.

I think some people try to make out that boys are at some kind of disadvantage nowadays (eg talk of the 'feminising of education'). IMO this is bollocks. We live in a patriarchy and denying boys' advantage in life is like denying white man's advantage living under apartheid.

I dont think that books like this (and that Steve Biddulph (sp?) book) I read a while back help at all.

I found this to be a little one sided too, perhaps because it is based so much on her personal experience and she has two boys, so naturally her experience of parenting girls is limited. I couldn't put my finger on examples (not least because DS keeps waking up) but something about it raised my hackles slightly.

That sounds like a good mantra to me SGM

I enjoyed DoG, but Cordelia is v focussed on the impact on girls and women and as such, it's a bit one-sided.