Women arrested for wearing burqas in France... what do you think?

Although, it is right, for the reasons I mentioned below.

AI is looking at this wrong - This is not about freedom to wear what you want, and the ban certainly isn't put in place because burqas are offensive.

This is about the medieval mentality that says women should be hidden from view lest men see a knee or a nose and are aroused beyond reason. The French don't want this mentality in their midst and rightly so as it goes against the very fibre of Frenchness, firmly secular and built on the tenet of Equality.

It is this mentality that is offensive, not some piece of cloth.

Lets face it, burkha is one side of a very complex issue at the heart of which French (and British) attitude to sharia law, strict islamic dress-code, role of women in society, etc.

I have posted on the other thread yesterday, but the Dutch are going to vote on whether to ban halal and kosher meat, as animals are subjected to unacceptable suffering. Does ones right to eat such meats stand above animals right to painless death? Some think "yes", some think "no"...

What about the right not to be subjected to sexual discrimination?

Incidentally, the right to do as one pleases is limited by the legal framework. The French debated and voted on the issue, so now it is a law, which should be respected.

I didn't say "majority makes right". Read my post again.

The fact that the ban is supported by the majority of French citizens does not make it right, CoteDAzur. Amnesty agrees:

"As a general rule, the rights to freedom of religion and expression entail that all people should be free to choose what - and what not - to wear. These rights cannot be restricted simply because some - even a majority -- find a form of dress objectionable or offensive."

Yes, and hence the popular support for the burqa ban.

Sarko is indeed not doing it for the right reasons. That doesn't mean there are no right reasons.

Then why is this ok?

This is not about the preservation of a secular society. It is about Sarkozy hijacking the Islamaphobia prevalent in France and other western countries and exploiting for his own ends.

Although I have to say, there have been some good arguments for the ban which have really made me think... It's just that this isn't one of them.

I love the way you made that point, bebe.

!

" Any US citizen can name all the states, place them on a map and name their capitals."
Haha - not the American woman I was at a dinner party with who assured everyone that New England was a state...

noddyholder "It is not up to the state to tell different religions how and when they are allowed to express their beliefs in the form of dress."

in the secular society it is exactly up to the state to 'tell different religions' the rules to protect the principle of secularism

This is also oppression.
It is not up to the state to tell different religions how and when they are allowed to express their beliefs in the form of dress.
Better to tackle the extreme islamists who enforce this so that the women who wear it have made an active choice and those who don't want to can stop wearing it. I don't understand all the 'its threatening' nonsense etc. Some of those women in France will feel naked without it and it is their right to feel comfortable in their own skin. Sarkozy is an idiot to implement this when the situation in the Middle east is so volatile he is just stoking the fire.

I don't agree with you being oppresses but I'll support your right to be oppressed if you choose to be...

I was at a feminist meeting tonight and the subject came up. Lots of differing views there too. My gut instinct is still that I am glad France has taken this step. If men wore the burkha too I wouldn't have an issue (though I might not understand it) but there is a distinct lack of men concealing themselves so that their only their wife can enjoy their body and face, at least where I live anyway...

Agree with both Indiestarr and Forkful.

I admire the French way of engineering the society they want (by democratic choice) even in the face of such controversy. And while in principle I'm against men dictating what women should wear (was the law brought into being entirely by men anyway? Unlikely..), why on earth WOULD a woman choose to wear one of those things? I feel very uneasy about the possibility of misogynistic elements of Islam permeating our culture if we are too afraid to object, and while this ban is a sledgehammer to crack a nut I think it's going in the right direction

Cuddly lefties on Newsnight buttering up the public for something similar to what Sarkozy is doing?

Burqa ban discussed on Newsnight now.