Porn - I use it and feel bad - help convince me porn is wrong

Oh, silly me that link I was looking for was posted on this very thread! Just earlier.

Prosperina - These women were all paid to be raped. It still isn't ok.
This link is far more evidence from the horses mouth than you can produce yourself. Basically, if this doesn't convince you, nothing will. www.shelleylubben.com/pornstars

I didn't asked you how many women in Hollywood are abused (that would be another entire thread I suspect). I asked you this;

"Prosperina how many Hollywood actresses do you know of who have had to go and have their anuses stitched after a days work? How many come off set having contracted a sexually transmitted disease?"

I then linked to an oft quoted doctor from Adult Industry Medical who says she sits there everyday sewing up anal tears and prolapses.

I Cannot Believe I Am Having This Conversation.

seriously Prosperina.
name me one non-porn Hollywood film in which there is a chance the actress has been asked to have anal sex with several men at once resulting in anal tears.

this kind of thing happens in porn. It does not happen in normal films. So yes, actually, we do know.

your arguments are really straining credulity here.

perhaps I missed it, but I haven't seen posts on here saying 'all women in porn are abused'. You seem, however, to be attempting to argue against the idea that abuse is common.

are you one of these people who has this very outdated idea of what porn is like and doesn't realise how much the violent and abusive stuff has taken over?

I really think you need to read Gail Dines.

Why? Why is it so important to challenge? This is what I never get. Why do women need to defend porn to such an extent? The only reasons I can ever think of make me so sad.

Apologies if I'm missing some people's posts here. Seth, I was typing fast, what I'm saying is I don't know how many in hollywood are being abused, and I don't know how many in porn are (I'm sure some are, and I'm also sure it attracts vulnerable young women), and importantly, neither do you?

www.shelleylubben.com/porn-quotes

"I sit there everyday and I sew up anal tears and anal prolapse and the physical conditions of what people are putting their bodies through is getting very, very far away from sexuality as we know it." - "Doctor" Sharon Mitchell Adult Industry Medical (AIM)

Beachcomber

Yes, I went to the link and commented on it - it all sounds very horrible

Dittany

No, I don't watch porn, no-one I know watches it, I'm actually pretty anti-porn,

But... what I'm challenging here is this black and white "all women are abused" ideas, "porn watchers hate women", ideas that seem so prevalent here.

"MacKinnon claims both that pornography is used by men ?to train women to sexual submission? (MacKinnon 1987, 188), and that ?pornography conditions male orgasm to female subordination? (MacKinnon 1987, 190). *In other words, pornography shapes both female and male sexual desire into victim/abuser roles that are then treated as natural forms of sexual and gender expression"

Is this why so many women are unable to understand the argument that is being made?

" Furthermore, pornography promotes rights violations not only of the female partners, friends, acquaintances, and relatives of the men who consume pornography, but also of the women who participate in its production, according to MacKinnon. This is because the acts caught on film in much pornography are allegedly coerced through intimidation and money. In MacKinnon?s words, pornography represents ?sex forced on real women so that it can be sold at a profit to be forced on other real women; women?s bodies trussed and maimed and raped and made into things to be hurt and obtained and accessed, and this presented as the nature of women; the coercion that is visible and the coercion that has become invisible ? this and more bothers feminists about pornography ? pornography causes attitudes and behaviors of violence and discrimination that define the treatment and status of half of the population? (MacKinnon 1987, 147). In short, a number of feminists conclude that pornography is not simply a reflection of sexism and male domination, but that it ?nourishes sexism?

My head hurts too, too much thinking and quite honestly I feel disapointed that some women can't see the problem and find it so depressing.

I haven't read Dines book, so I am off to find it.

Apologies: yes that was meant for the other thread. I get confused by these circular aguments, the same denial and refusal to face up to the truth of this stuff, the same intellectullay vacuous pro-porn arguments, the same shit really. It's depressing, but so, so predictable

I don't understand Prosperina, are you actually saying you don't know to 'how many Hollywood actresses do you know of who have had to go and have their anuses stitched after a days work? How many come off set having contracted a sexually transmitted disease?'

(I'd agree that slapping and hair pulling might happen on occasion - Hitchcock was reputedly pretty nasty to his actresses, but that would be extreme, whereas for many porn actresses that would count as a good day).

Prosperina did you even follow Msrisotto's link?

Did you look at the picture of that young woman with a gag chained on her and a collar on her neck? Did you read the text?

"The movies Hunter starred in were the degrading, extreme violence that we see in pornography where the women are tied up, chained, gagged and labeled as 'sluts' or 'fresh meat' and treated like disposable objects for men or gangs of men to use up and throw away."

What is wrong with people that they cannot see abuse when it is right in front of them?

Are you going to show a picture of Marilyn Monroe being gagged, spat on, chained up and choked before being brutally penetrated by a gang of men? Thought not

Beachcomber, guess what, I don't know, that's the point, and neither do you

THanks for the link. Here's another report for you

catalogue.mup.com.au/978-0-522-85340-7.html

Jenny, who are you referring to there? I'm not refusing to read Dines

Has the world just gone completely mad?

Am I really being asked by a woman on the feminist section of MN of evidence that women in porn are abused?

Prosperina how many Hollywood actresses do you know of who have had to go and have their anuses stitched after a days work? How many come off set having contracted a sexually transmitted disease? How many are verbally abused and slapped and have their hair pulled?

Read Jensen. (Hint - you will have to open your eyes to do it.)

(Jenny - was that post meant for the other thread?)

msrisotto

Thanks for the link, but you see the problem there, don't you? Marilyn Monroe committed suicide, do you boycott hollywood?

God this thread is so disturbing.

I think that's necessary though.

TBH I just don't have the stomach to wade through all that awful stuff - the titles are bad enough.

I know this stuff exists, I saw some once by mistake - a trailer for a MH thing. It was so disturbing - I screamed and burst into tears when I saw it (an exbf, it was promptly switched off). Previous to that I really, really had no idea.

Sincere thanks to Dittany, Beachcomber, SGM, Eggy, jenny60, seth, prolesworth (sorry if I've missed anyone out). Keep up the good work.

The fact that you're refusing to read Dimes at least and relying on a wikepedia criticism of her work tells me everything I need to know about your commitment to finding out about the industry.

I'm being perfectly consistent, one woman abused is one woman too many - that doesn't mean the porn industry should be banned - it means steps should be taken to stop it happening again, and for the guilty to be prosecuted

In the mean time more evidence that will probably be ignored or not good enough but hey ho

Dittany,

Are you against marriage, because I know one women who was abused by her husband?