can i be a feminist and a sahm?

What Flamingo said. My thoughts exactly.

I can't think about it SaF. UNfathomable, as you say. And then they dosed the slaves with drugs if they showed a bit of their humanity by not being happy as a slave. I seriously can't think about the consequences of knowing the full implications of this, when it comes to men's humanity.

Oh, I realise I've shit-canned my career although I do think that the type of job I wanted to do would have been incompatible with children anyway (unless you've got a wife)

I'm a SAHM. I'm also in a very equal marriage where my work is valued as highly, if not more so, by my DH and myself as his. He contributes the pay; I do the bulk of the work of bringing up and educating our children. We share everything 50:50 when he's at home.

But, although this was a choice initially, thanks to the fucking shitty way our patriarchal society is set up, it is no longer a choice. Now I am trapped as a SAHM. Yes, I probably would still choose to do it if I had a choice, but feeling trapped makes me want out IYSWIM - grass is always greener... But I am livid that my earning potential is now far too low for me to ever be the WOHP. It's far too low to be able to afford for childcare for four children.

If society were set up in favour of the primary care-givers for dependent people, then you'd be able to be financially secure in your own right and be your children's primary care giver. It is utterly crap that you have to choose. I'm proud of my work, I don't judge those who don't stay at home, but I do think ideally children shouldn't have to be cared for someone who isn't a close relative but I don't agree that that has to be the mother.

So now, after years of thinking 'I've done alright for myself in this patriarchal society', I am now realising that I am a victim of it too. I'm stuck here, with no way out for very many years and I no longer have a choice.

ABsolutely Dittany,
But it takes us back to the split between public and private sphere that the patriarchy has manufactured . In the past, the home and economic production would have been seamlessly integrated before they appropriated our skills and sold them back to us

I think feminists were right to emphasize women's economic independance, but this was hijacked, and we all know how the media is used by the patriarchy as a tool used to distort the feminist message
SO instead of showing feminism in a holistic way, they just focused on the bits that benefited them. Carework has been devalued even more than it already was, if that was even possible.

that was liberal feminism apparently SaF. Although tbf, it wasn't really feminists' fault per se. The patriarchy hijacked the bits of feminism they liked and dumped the rest just like they always do.

I could talk all day about the various incidences of women being duped and manipulated by the patriarchy, believing they were acting for feminism, when in fact the original feminist theory had been completed transformed into a patriarchal agenda by the time the masses caught on.

Interesting point re "true choices" and the pressures patriarchal society puts on women when it comes to deciding to be a SAHM or not.

In many cases, of course, it simply isn't viable for the woman to be a SAHM, economically the partnership needs her salary to help pay for the household costs...and in the longer term, the woman doesn't want to give up her job/career because of future economic prospects (as well as her own self-fulfillment, career desires etc.)

In my case, I'm potentially the higher earner, but I preferred to be a SAHM because of my own inclinations. As a breast-feeding mum, I wanted to be there for my DD and also I didn't see the point of paying a fair amount of my wages to someone else to look after my child when I could do so myself.
(I hasten to add I have absolutely no problem with women who prefer to return to work, this is simply my preference).

DH actually offered several times to be SAHD if I wanted him to, but didn't put on any pressure either way, so it felt like it was genuinely my choice.

He also sees it as his duty to shoulder more than half of the domestic burden (cleaning/cooking/laundry etc.) when he's not at work and is also willing and happy to do any childcare.

I'm lucky because he's pretty enlightened and I genuinely do feel that I've made a choice to commit full-time to motherhood.

Or am I kidding myself?

I don't see why paid employment makes you a feminist-it is such a small part of who you are.

I am a basic spoilt brat honey xxxxx

Yes-why not?

Suziewho, I know the link shouldn't be there but it does seem to be in real life, often. With kids, tiding up behind them is very difficult to avoid ime.

Wikileeks, out of genuine intrest (cos I could never bear to ask DP for anything much apart from his accpeance of his responsiblity towards our DS and the housework - but circumstnaces in this recession may force us to accpet whatever comes our way), how do you feel about that?

I feel queasy just reading the word 'work'

Just thought. The thing is that if I work a 40 odd (or more) hour week in any workplace I feel no need to 'tip my boss the wink' or anything else to get my paycheque. I have earned the money and it is mine to spend how I want. Why, I wonder, should it be different for SAHM??

PS - agree with youllskimmer - is some amazing achievement - even more impressive than just making women feel bad for working if they were married/had children.

Hmmm I also need to add that himself works from home and does the school run and most of the cooking,I am a lazy git xxxxxxxx

I don't see the link with being a SAHM and "looking after the home". When I think of SAHM I think of someone primarily concerned with looking after DC(s). Housework, household admin etc, etc is separate from that.

Perhaps this is the problem. Do people consider a SAHM to also be a housewife, with no input from partners?

Apologies if I've missed something. Tired tonight!

I don't mind NES at all,I have been a little unfair,its he who begs me,and I shout ... wedges/weekend break/a cast iron pan if you please .... everything I do is for a laugh,I am not good with serious anything including this,I just want fun fun fun,now go enjoy your wine for some reason I am surfing kitchens and we don't even need one .

I think it's been the greatest achievement of the Patriarchy to perpetuate the belief that women should sacrifice their careers to look after the children therefore leaving men to pursue their own careers.

Women feel guilty if they work, guilty if they don't and it seems guilty if they work part-time. It is some achievement.

I suppose, what I am thinking is: the thing is that if you are a SAHM and you 'work' by rasing kids and looking after a home, you shouldn't have to 'tip anybody the wink' for wedges or anything else. Your work is valuable. The problem is that it is not recogsnised as 'work'. It has a measurable economic worth, but is not paid. You should, as you work, be free to choose wedges or not without tipping anybody a wink or anything else.

[still not as clear as I would like...]

I'm a feminist and I chose to give up paid work temporarily to look after DD until she starts school.

Yes - undoubtedly you can be a feminist and a SAHM. :)

Maybe it is all I know is I have seen some wedges I want and I have just tipped him the wink,those shoes shall be mine by close of trading tomorrow.....

Wikileeks, I admit that I have a half a bottle of wine inside me now so am not at my most articulate....

I do know though that there have been women who have (convincingly to my mind) argued that 'holding your husband to ransom for shoes and holidays' - or a better standard of living - is a feminist act in itself. I think they meant that you are fighting for a better standard of living using the powers which you have available to you in your position, as a low/unpaid worker, at that time.

[hmm - sounds very confused now I read it back. perhaps I will have to digest wine and get back to you if that is not clear....]