Active discussions

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Lack of convictions for RAPE...I really want to do something about this, if possible

142 replies

InmaculadaConcepcion · 03/03/2011 12:57

Having just read about the DM story concerning the man acquitted of rape because he was "too drunk" and the subsequent horrendous account of a poster's own failed attempt to get justice for her rape on the same thread I am spitting with rage.

I want to do something positive. I have a baby daughter and I don't think I can be comfortable with myself if I don't make some attempt to fight for justice for rape victims and send out a message that RAPE IS A SERIOUS CRIME AND SHOULD BE TREATED AS SUCH.

I have two thoughts so far about this:

  1. Set up a campaigning blog reproducing press accounts of rape cases and (where no press reports exist) publishing rape survivors' own accounts.

and

  1. Set up a charity specifically to raise funds to assist rape survivors to pursue civil cases against their attackers.

These are just kernels of ideas at the moment, but I would welcome any suggestions about how I could make this work.

OP posts:
LeninGrad · 03/03/2011 16:53

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Prolesworth · 03/03/2011 16:44

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

sethstarkaddersmackerel · 03/03/2011 16:43

x-posts with Scurry

sethstarkaddersmackerel · 03/03/2011 16:42

it's probably way easier to get a woman for making it up than to get a rapist - if they get her to sign something to say none of it was true they've got all they need to prosecute her.

scurryfunge · 03/03/2011 16:42

And I agree about the misogyny too.

scurryfunge · 03/03/2011 16:41

If you take out the nature of the crime itself, Police and CPS will find the easy route to convict anyone for any crime -usually with an admission attached. No one admits to rape but people will admit to perverting the course of justice if all the information shows that is the case. It is easier to show.

Mamaz0n · 03/03/2011 16:40

yes yes i agree. A conviction of PTCOJ is high profile yet the rape cases get a one inch paragraph at the side of the local paper.

SardineQueen · 03/03/2011 16:40

If women are being pursued more vigorously and punished more harshly for making it up, than men are for actually raping people, then I really think there is an issue there.

If it is the case then it certainly demonstrates very clearly a built-in misogyny in the entire criminal justice system.

Prolesworth · 03/03/2011 16:37

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

scurryfunge · 03/03/2011 16:37

That particular case drew a lot of attention and I do not think it is representative of ordinary investigations. We need to keep some perspective and concentrate on raising the conviction rates for rape and not dwell on the very very few number of women who make up allegations.

SardineQueen · 03/03/2011 16:37

And that given that rape is super-common, while false claims are rare, it seems to indicate that maybe the criminal justice system take cases of women who have lied much more seriously than cases where women have been raped.

Sorry for multiple posts.

SardineQueen · 03/03/2011 16:36

But on the whole obviously if someone has made a malicious allegation and wasted police time then yes they should face the consequences.

My point was simply that the police and CPS seem to be far more adept at prosecuting these women than they do men who rape people. I don't have any stats to back that up, just that I read about it in the paper all the time, while i don't read about successful prosecutions for rape very often at all.

SardineQueen · 03/03/2011 16:32

I don't know that anyone has said that the police shouldn't prosecute when there are false allegations mamazon?

Personally I think it should be case by case. For example if a woman is mentally ill then I'm not sure that treatment wouldn't be more appropriate. I also disagreed with the decision recently to imprison that woman for falsely withdrawing allegations.

Mamaz0n · 03/03/2011 16:28

I will go against my feminist freinds and say that if a woman has been proven to have made a false accusation then the police are correct in prosecuting.

Whilst there are women who make such allegations it makes those who are brave enough to make a true accusation all that harder.

SardineQueen · 03/03/2011 16:22

I'm sure they could garlicbutter.

However as very few claims of rape are actually malicious/made up, you probably wouldn't see much happen from that.

Reading the news it also seems to me that while the police and CPS are very poor at obtaining convictions for rape, when they find out a woman has lied they are excellent at prosecuting her.

garlicbutter · 03/03/2011 16:16

Interesting, link, Sardine Queen, thank you! Good for her :) It's the first time I've thought about this. Sorry if I seem a but dumb. Do accused (unconvicted) rapists ever sue for defamation? If complainants are protected from this in a criminal case, would a civil case expose them to counter-claims?

Mamaz0n · 03/03/2011 16:16

It pisses me off that a victims sexual history can be bought up.

It is like a burglar using the home owners previous burgalries as a defence, they obviously ask to be stilen from. They must enjoy it, they send out the wrong signals etc .

Rape is the one and only criminal act that i can think of where teh victim is blamed.

Original poster
InmaculadaConcepcion · 03/03/2011 15:59

The idea of having a campaigning blog was to try and draw attention to the situation, publicise the names of those dubiously acquitted (while we still can) and lobby for further changes in the law.

So, not being as well-versed in the current legal situation as many of you clearly are, that's why advice on what we think we should realistically call for is very helpful.

Meanwhile, I shall certainly do more research into it to get myself properly genned up.

The fund-raising etc. for bringing civil actions is to meanwhile try to secure some sort of justice for those essentially disenfranchised by the criminal law.

OP posts:
SardineQueen · 03/03/2011 15:54

I think it's a good idea IC, I really do.

You sound well placed to "do something" as well. Keep posting I'm interested to see where this goes!

Prolesworth · 03/03/2011 15:54

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

Original poster
InmaculadaConcepcion · 03/03/2011 15:52

I totally take the point about civil prosecutions not taking the place of criminal prosecutions, but as we don't live in an ideal world, my line of reasoning was that realistically, if we can obtain some reparation for rape survivors through the court in this way, then that's something important.

It would also send out a powerful message that rapists aren't necessarily above the law just because they secured an acquittal after a criminal trial.

OP posts:
Original poster
InmaculadaConcepcion · 03/03/2011 15:50

Some really helpful responses here, loads of food for thought - thanks.

Apologies for the absence, I've been dancing attendance on DD (and will have to continue to do so, so further posts are likely to be a bit sporadic).

First up, what makes me qualified to try and do something like this?

Well, apart from being an outraged member of the public, I did until fairly recently work in the broadcast news media, and had done for well over a decade before leaving to do some travelling and teaching in another country.

It doesn't make me an expert in any way, but it does mean I have some useful contacts up my sleeve in terms of publicity, politicians, the legal profession and others I encountered in the course of my work. So in theory, the blog side of things should be reasonably well up my alley to handle.

OP posts:
SardineQueen · 03/03/2011 15:47

Would need to go hand in hand with pressing the police and CPS to up their game. If this happened (charity for women to press civil charges or similar) then you'd need to keep a sharp eye that women weren't doing it instead as that would be bad.

SardineQueen · 03/03/2011 15:46

garlic look at what happened here

So for women who get a not guilty in criminal court, or for whom the CPS won't press charges, it might be a means to get some recognition of what happened to them.

HandDivedScallopsrgreat · 03/03/2011 15:43

garlicbutter - I think that the suggestion is to go through a civil court if criminal proceedings have failed. Not instead of criminal proceedings.

Swipe left for the next trending thread