Why no men at events like MWR?

at AL's post about picketing the menz

I guess this means we have to stop picketing the innumerable meetings of pro-feminist men planning their own marches to stop male violence against women? They will be so relieved if we just leave them in peace to fight sexism which they love doing even more than they love football.

hi all,

yes i meant standing up for womens only marches i am sorry i am not good at writing.

Yes it's a good one, Alice, will try to remember it.

Dittany - I was wearing my specs and everything :o

I'll remember that AW, that's a very interesting analogy.

And interesting analogy I heard re this was that if Rosa Parks had been accompanied by a white person to sit on the bus, it would have been like she was being chaperoned, or helped, or legitimated by the white person. She had to be able to say I am here, I am black and I am doing this. Otherwise it would not have had the impact and would have carried a different message. Just like a million women rising and saying no.

Statement from White Ribbon Campaign re Reclaim the Night:

We understand and affirm women's right to self-organisation ... When women create safe, collective women-only spaces to organise, share experiences, and learn from each other, we support and respect that space.

link to full statement

I think you may like this

I think she meant "standing up for women-only", at least, it makes sense that way in context.

Glad to see we agree then, dittany. :o I agree that men should start their own marches (and are, in various places), but we all know how hard it is for women to organise on these issues, I imagine men face similar issues.

I think there is a place on the MWR website which explains this very question for your friend.

Let me see if I can link

all very good points and its good to see people standing up to it being a womens only march i have posted about mwr on other websites and have got very angry responses about it being women only.

quote ElephantsAndMiasmas

What I would like to see though is a mixed demo in the calendar. Because it would really challenge people's viewpoints to see men marching with women on this issue. Suddenly it wouldn't just be "lesbians" or "man haters" etc, but families marching together, couples, brothers and sisters (my bro would love to come), adult sons with their mothers or grandmothers, girls with their grandfathers. Plenty of men have lost their loved ones to male violence committed by others, or had to support women/girls in their lives through the trauma of rape or attack. They might want to come along and help to swell the ranks of people saying THIS IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH.

this is a great idea and i agree that this needs to be done aswell. its so brilliant seeing all this greatness from wonderful people it brings a tear to my eye.

thanks for showing me that i am not alone :)

As I said, I think that RTN should be women only (although men having a supportive demo is good AFAIC too, perhaps away from the main march though), and I think MWR should be women only. Both for good, though different reasons.

What I would like to see though is a mixed demo in the calendar. Because it would really challenge people's viewpoints to see men marching with women on this issue. Suddenly it wouldn't just be "lesbians" or "man haters" etc, but families marching together, couples, brothers and sisters (my bro would love to come), adult sons with their mothers or grandmothers, girls with their grandfathers. Plenty of men have lost their loved ones to male violence committed by others, or had to support women/girls in their lives through the trauma of rape or attack. They might want to come along and help to swell the ranks of people saying THIS IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH.

Totally agree with Dittany about the symbolism of men being on a RTN march.

There may be a place for male support of feminism, and in truth it is obligatory for the success of feminism to get support from men, but at this point in time a RTN march is not a place where men should be IMO.

Men aren't "demanding" anything Dittany.

We, women, are asking why men can't show their support for a cause that they think is important.

really Dittany? I think having a small group of men join the march at a fixed point in a way that is very clearly subservient to the overall point of the march, which is women marching for themselves, makes the point quite well that there is a place for men as supporters of a woman-led movement.

Oh come on, dittany. Some men are dicks who will be all "oi, what about men? when's our march? you're all sexists!". BUT there are others, including people I know, who genuinely want to come out onto the streets and say that they are outraged by violence against women, how often it happens and how rarely the perpetrators are punished. Yes they do things like sign the white ribbon pledge and talk to other men etc, but they want to help in other ways too.

I would love to see a mixed march for women's rights, because at the moment it gives the impression, as we go through the streets, that only women can care about women's rights. Or that we are all living in a women-only world. Whereas in fact many of us are living with men, or have close relationships with sons, fathers, brothers, friends etc who do give a toss about this injustice as well.