Are there still any laws that apply to women but not men?

Yes it does, I'm just surprised, and very surprised that men get 3 x the length of time that women do for the exact same crime.

For instance there was all that stuff about how loads of women were in prison for not paying their TV licence, and other things related to debt, while men got sent to prison for more serious crimes (violence) and were unlikely to be jailed for something like shoplifting.

The thing I saw earlier made the point that most women going to prison have no previous convictions, while most men do - that will affect sentences and will not be obvious from basic data. Ditto something like theft - a man might be more likely to mug and a woman to shoplift - I would say that mugging was a "worse" crime, but there is no way of seeing what the subdivisions are.

I would be really surprised to see that men get 3 x more than women for the exact same crime - that would have been noticed, surely.

The info lenak linked to certainly indicates that woman are sentenced more leniently than men overall (although will concede it is a little old).

here's a recent thing from the prison reform trust.

some interesting stuff from HMRC

Heroine you are just saying what you have heard though, I have heard different, it would be great if what I have heard is incorrect.

You said that for the same crime, men get sentences 3x longer than for women and said it was on the direct gov site so it must be in your history, please can you link.

btw on women's hour they cited suicidal feelings as being 'evidence' that women found prison more traumatic, but missed out (to my disgust actually) that men are far more likely to commit suicide in prison than women. I have also heard that women in prison are more supportive of each other than men are, but I think that was on the same show.

I know its hard, but i think that if I get beaten up by another woman, she should get convicted of assault and get the right penalty for assault. If she is the sole carer for her children, lets have creches in prison, but I don't think we can ask for fairness one way, but not the other.

Oh for god's sake - when I get a moment I'll do some hunting for you but other posters have clearly found plenty that you still are refusing to believe. Women get a lot of leniency when compared to men - women's hour had a whole programme on it last year, and the government's concern was not about the fact that women get locked up more than men for trivial offences, but that even though women get locked up for a third as long than men do CRIME FOR CRIME there is an argument for even more leniency for trivial offences because a) women supposedly find jail more tramatic than men (back to the old delicate flower theory that I hate) and b) because of childcare.

Richard and Judy show also had a special on this where they interviewed women prisoners who agreed that women were let off lightly, but deserved it because of their kids.

It would be great to really be able to believe that women are not punished more harshly than men in the Uk for like-for-like crimes, or imprisoned for lesser crimes.

I am still interested in the specific direct.gov info that heroine was talking about.

I have had a look, there's not a lot there.

here is something saying that the govt thought that too many women were being jailed for minor offences.

Elsewhere (will try to find it again) it points out that the stats showing sentences which are lower for women than for men, don't include detail - a major thing being that many women who are sent to prison have no previous convictions, while many men have - and this obviously impacts on sentences.

My personal experience is that men do get longer custodial sentences than woman, particularly mothers, on a like for like basis.

The assertion that more woman are in prison for lesser crimes is presumably not comparative?

And tabloe 2.14 in the same link shows that the average sentence for women is less than for men in every offence category except Criminal Damage.

So it seem Heroine is correct

Without the crimes it doesn't mean anything though. I was under the impression that men are far more likely to commit violent crime than women, which might explain why more of them get sent to prison, and for longer...

But that crime for crime, women are penalised more harshly than men.

Waiting to be enlightened by Heroine.

Actually just found this:

rds.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs05/hosb1505.pdf

Table 2.13 shows that for every type of offence except Drug Offences, men are massively more likely to be given a custodial sentence than women.

I've had a quick look and can't find anything that breaks down sentences for crime type by gender (and haven't got time to look further right now), but it seems men are twice as likely to receive a custodial sentence for an inditable offence.

In 2009 58,802 men were given immediate custodial sentences - 29.5% of all men sentenced

In the same period 6,016 women were given an immediate custodial sentence - 16.1% of all women sentenced.

So, it may be true that women get proportionately longer sentences, but are half as likely to be sentenced to a custodial sentence in the first place.

I'm quite prepared to believe Heroine if she shows me the evidence (rather than vaguely asserts it is out there). The edition of 'Eve was framed' I read was from the 90s so things may have changed. In the absence of evidence, though, I'll go with the distinguished feminist law expert rather than the random internet person....

I'm still waiting for Heroine's link. She seemed very sure, let's see what it says...

God I didn't know that women got more prison time, crime for crime (studiously ignoring Heroine ). That is really quite shocking and really quite indicative of society's view of women isn't it?

Hum, according to this, women (and children) were banned from working underground in 1842 - because of the appalling conditions - but that in 1900 part of the act was repealed 'giving women the choice to work underground.'

"Ooh and I'm pretty sure (or maybe I've seen it in a disaster movie) that only men are allowed to work with radioactive stuff as it would fry womens reproductive bits too much."

I'm sure that's not the case now

where a custondial sentence is the penalty typically give sentences three times as long to men than to women

crap. crime for crime, women go to jail for uch longer.

on average the female sentence is lower, but this is because they are often sent to jail for trivial offences that men would not get custodial sentences for.

so you are saying female shoplifters getting shorter sentences than male armed robbers is a sign of bias?

Well this woman won the right to be a Forest of Dean Freeminer recently so it is probably now allowable for women to be miners.

But they can now join the Antarctic Survey!

Not a law as such but Women are not allowed to work on submarines in case they are already/become pregnant.

Men get maternity leave if the women dies in childbirth or within the time length of the maternity leave (or if the woman is incapacitated e.g. in a coma).