New rape survey - "How Far is Too Far?"

I usually say "so you're so shit in bed that you've got no control? Really? Remind me not to shag you darling, won't you?" (OK I don't say the last bit... )

I have had this discussion with men in the past and I am very vocal about my feelings ..

if a man I have talked to says he starts and doesn't understand why he has to stop because a woman changes her mind or 'once she gets naked then what does she expect?' I have said straight..

'you know you have probably raped a woman if that is how you feel about consent'...

This doesn't surprise me at all.

Just shows what a shit job schools are doing at PHSE.

There is a summary of the survey done by The Havens here www.thehavens.co.uk/docs/where_is_the_line.pdf but doesn't include the whole methodology including the exact questions. Via @CRASAC (Coventry Rape Crisis) aka Sarah Learmouth.

Agree chocolate. Read once that thats partly why the McCanns got torn apart in the media - people like to think that if they do this that and the other they'll be safe, because they can't face the nasty truth that one day they may be raped or have their child taken, and there's nothing they can do about it.

I don't know.
Do men really feel that differently about sex? A compartalised action of no meaning.
In that case why wouldn't a woman just put themselves out for a few minutes, and brush it off. The way you often hear men, well boys really, sniggering about sex with some 'slut'. Not proud but at least it's a ride.
Rambling. Someone set me straight.

Just thoroughly depressed this evening.

I think lots of women think that way too. I think it gives them a false sense of safety because they can kid themselves that if they don't do x, y or z then they will be safe. Or they have been raped and are finding it hard to name it because of all the crap that is out there. I dunno, it's all really depressing.

what has angered me more is that i have overheard women discussing this topic and have given similar views to those expressed on the comments of that article.

it is utterly depressing

Read a few of the comments. What amazes me is the amount of people who seem to believe that the law somehow favours women. What planet are these people living on?

This has really depressed me today. It all seems so hopeless.

Maybe if some of the men commented got burgled and were. Sneered at by their neighbours, disbelieved by their colleagues and told by the media that it served them right for owning a plasma tv. Maybe then they'd see how ridiculous the argument is.

Some of these people are scary .

All this survey has done is reinforce my view that when I go out I don?t drink alcohol, I stay with my friends, don?t wear anything too ?provocative? and make sure everyone gets home safely. Wouldn?t it be nice to go out and relax?

god those comments

I consider the male argument about women getting drunk or dressing provocatively are asking for it ad comparable to saying an elderly woman carrying. Bag deserves to be mugged.

It is a pathetic and nonsensical argument.

Can't face reading the comments. The point of no return is bullshit. If a guy was having sex with a girl and his mum, gran and aunty Jean walked in the room I am fairly certain he would be able to stop.

How about this instead:

Men who wish to avoid the risk of being accused of rape should perhaps consider not getting so drunk that they do not know (or care) what they are doing.

Agreed vezzie - I thought that after I pressed post.

Those comments are fucking ridiculous. Do people seriously still believe this shit? I guess they do

'OmicronPosted by: Omicron on November 17, 2010 12:26 PM

Women who wish to avoid the risk of being raped should perhaps consider not getting so drunk that they do not know (or care) what they are doing. If being drunk is not an excuse for a man who commits rape why is being drunk a defence for a woman?'

Er no, they only women can avoid being raped is if men stop raping them. I couldn't read any further than that

earwicga "because we aren't human"

I know what you mean, but - I have thought this often on other threads - sorry to be pedantic, but please can we remember to say something like "because we are not perceived as fully human". I know it's obvious really but there are all kinds of (sometimes wilful) idiots who might be reading this and the shorthand might be read as if we are agreeing that women are not human.

there are a couple of people on there who would warrant further investigation - Russy and MeltonMark. These shits are out in our town centres.

This comment from the article explains it nicely - the law allows men to take the piss

The whole no means no campaign has made the consent thing much more difficult for rape victims.

There is some excellent work by a feminist whose name escapes me whose research is categorical that it is very unrealistic that women are expected to say a categorical "no". In every other social situation, we are taught to say things without offence and with manners, e.g. a friend calls up to ask you out for dinner and you don't want to go, do you say "no." Or do you say " oh that would have been lovely but actually I have already eaten tonight and don't really have any money etc".

Yet, it is only is a sex situation, which is potentially dangerous if you do offend, that you are expected to be rude and categorical. Men are human beings and know this, and yet the law system perpetuates the consent myth because it suits misogyny.

those comments are vile and leave me in no doubt as to why rape happens.

there is an overwhelming sense of entitlement to sex from those men posting.

disgusting.

sex is not a right.

The comments really are horrible. I only read 3 then gave up. It seems such a huge mountain to climb to teach people such a basic thing as informed consent.

Perhaps Russy would like to spend some time at Her Majesty's Pleasure (as he deserves by the sounds of things), then come back and tell us what consensual sex is and what it isn't.

I know that's a horrible thing to say but some people are only capable of learning what pain is by experiencing the abuse they've inflicted for themselves.