"What about the men that get raped?"

Sal, I don't want to come across as if I'm speaking for dittany, but what that post made me think was, if I were someone who'd been raped or mugged, and went on a march, it could be traumatic to find that instead of it being the all-women event I'd expected, there were also men there, probably making shouting and waving things, as people do on marches.

It wouldn't be about rational response to danger - I wouldn't rationally think I was about to be hurt by these men. But it's only respectful to realize that trauma has effects that aren't rational, so the march should be a safe space for women who've been through it.

Does that make sense?

Yes, I agree with that Sal. He shouldn't get slated for not understanding. It sounds as if he thought it was primarily about preventing crime ... which I guess is one of the things it's about but it's also about changing attitudes.

Men don't get told that they're stupid to get caught in the dark outside - that's an attitude that doesn't need changing. Women do.

Little red that was in response to: My goodness I would never go on a reclaim the night march with men in it. It's men who have flashed at me, followed me, shouted at me, groped me and generally intimidated me on the streets. How would I know the men marching beside me hadn't done those things to women?

It irks me whenever someone defines a race/gender etc based on bad experiences with some in those groups.

I think though I am drifting away from the OP the man in question didn't know what Reclaim was about so asked fair enough. Then asked why can't male victims join as well? which is a fair question from someone who is just learning about that event is about. All you need to tell him is that Reclaim is specifically for women who feel to take a stand against violence towards women and that if men wish to make a similar event there is nothing stopping them.

plenty of women do get raped by strangers in the street though, unfortunately. Acknowledging that most rapes are by people you know doesn't magically mean that stranger rapes don't happen.

What do you mean by the first sentence Sal? Sorry, I am being thick today.

So you basically see all men as potential problems then I guess if you were to slip a race in the place of 'males' you would have no problem with it?

As too walking on the streets women are actually less likely to be attacked then men specifically young men when it comes to violent assaults/murders. As to rape this crime is generally perpetrated by people the victim knows rather than some stranger on the street at night. It would be far better to get rid of the all rapists are strangers in the night ideology.

That's a good point dittany - it could be upsetting to someone who'd been hurt.

I suspect if it were explained to this guy that the women's march is not about stopping men from doing their own, he'd very soon realize that the men's march would have a different focus anyway (maybe more focused on removing the stigma from men suffering from ddomestic violence?). But he did only ask about it.

I don't get why men would be so keen to come on a Reclaim the Night march - surely if they support the aims of the march they would be happy to show that support by staying away from just that one event?

One would expect the attitude of the male supporters of the march to be somewhat different to men who abuse women in the street though.

While most of the women I know are cautious about being out alone after dark - even if they do it, there's a bit of trepidation there.

Is this really a huge problem for men? It's a new one on me.

I'm confused. We need to march to reclaim the streets for men at night? I don't know any men who don't feel that they can't go out by themselves after dark.

Agree with what others have said about teh point of reclaim the night being to do with women normally feeling scared about walking alone at night / not going out / going around in groups and so on. Women do this because they fear being raped or sexually assaulted. I do not think that many men have this feeling - fear of rape when it is dark and they are alone, and while many men are attacked in other ways while out at night I don;t know any who fear it all the time they are out after dark.

That's what reclaim the night is about.

Just thought - that ad showing a woman's screaming face - the ad for cabs in london. You don;t get adverts like that aimed at men. For lots of reasons.

OP - I agree with him as well. Sexual abuse and rape are so under-reported by women for well documented reasons. These reasons make it even less unlikely that a man reports.

Let your friend know that not all RTN marches are closed to men. The one in Bangor is open to everyone.

I think this is overly harsh (to this particular man), and the stats are beside the point.

As the OP describes it, he's just asking questions. Maybe it comes across as critical of what she's doing, but why not just explain that she does believe men and women should be treated equally and would be respectful of a men's march should there be one?

According to the British Crime Survey, the number of rapes recorded by the police in 2009/10 was:

1,174 rapes of a male

13,991 rapes of a female

great posts Beachcomber

Oh and anyone who says to a feminist that 'because you want men and women to be equal you should be campaigning for men as well as women' is being a bit thick really.

It would be a bit like saying to women campaigning for women to get the vote that they should campaign for men too.

Except there the answer would be a straightforward 'piss off and stop wasting my time - men have already got the vote/privilege/power/status/control/a relatively easy ride you ignorant, oblivious fool'.

Your friend seems to not actually have a clue what the point of Reclaim the Night is.

It is totally and utterly irrelevant to male rapes or DV. Saying that does not mean those issues do not matter.

Men need to get off their arses and start campaigns instead of expecting women to do it in their place.

Your friend may be well meaning but he is being insensitive and shows a fairly standard male lack of understanding of women's issues.

He probably doesn't intend it this way but this sort of thing just sounds to me like women shouldn't even be allowed to consider fighting for themselves until they have sorted out the problems of every man in the world.