Feminism and our mothers' reactions

Fascinating thread.

My mum is a feminist (she's in her 60s) and I am too. We discuss feminist issues a lot (among other things).

I always think of it as a default position for women and am surprised so many women actively disagree with/dislike feminism.

I wonder if they feel threatened by it on some level (genuine, non sarky q).

When I was growing up I thought my mum was a stauch feminist - wierdly as I have got older, she seems less and less engaged with it generally. My dad is great (now), but he has not been the easiest of people to be married to, and I think she rejects feminism so that she doesn't have to analyse her relationship that closely. I don't tend to discuss it with her as I would hate to have her dismiss something that means a great deal to me. I am very close to her in most other ways though.

On the other hand my sister who has a great career, fast car, own house etc, would rather die before she called herself a feminist and we have HUGE rows about it. And to conflate the other thread, I would consider myself something of a rad fem, even though I cannot articulate it as well as some here.

My mum is a feminist, but without understanding what a feminist is, iyswim.

She is strong, forthright and also compassionate. She's only 49 though, so I'm not sure if that has anything to do with it.

She was hit by her first serious partner and vowed that she would never be dependent on a man. She left him and met and married my dad. She always worked, even when we were young; she has her own bank account and takes no crap.

When DH and I were getting married she told me to leave out the word "obey" in the vows

MIL on the other hand... ummm, less I say the better.

Surely some of these men feel guilty about this though?

Yes agree with sprogger.

Nothing strokes a man's ego like knowing that his clever wife could be a board director, but chooses instead to clean his house and raise his children, leaving him free to pursue his career.

(I'm not being anti-SAHM here btw., I think child-rearing is valuable work, but I'm looking at it from an individual man's POV.)

Wow sproggers. Is that guy still involved in education? I had a male teacher compare me to joan of arc once. Still think of that now. urrrrr.

I don't understand why anyone worth marrying would want to marry someone stupider than them anyway.

And yes why the assumption that once that ring is on your finger your entire earlier life will slip away like a dream.

Wildstrawberries, I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall when you were first wandering around campus. One of your mum's friends should have made a documentary.

Actually this sums up my mum's attitude. She said to me when I was about 19 and ranting about something 'you can't change the world' and went on then to advise me my energies would be better spent working out how to fit in to it. She still agrees with that approach and 100% believes that at the end of the day it's the 'cleverest' path becuase you only get one life.

God just typing it I almsot believe it for a second and then I shudder and come 'round. I've never been able to even though she TRAINED me to play this part.

Nice, well i'm new to the feminist 'scene' and this was the first time I had mentioned anything remotely activist to my mum. I don't think she reacted the way she did because i'd been harping on about equality.

You may be right claig - about the concern for the future thing. My mother (extremely bolshy herself) used to warn me as a teenager that boys don't like girls who are cleverer than them or who have strong opinions. God knows what I was supposed to do with that information, and I think she'd have been horrified if I'd started a simpering and giggling habit, but I think she felt it was her duty to warn me. Also for her generation growing up in the 60s they were dealing with male contemporaries who really did have a more dark ages mentality - they assume we'll be dealing with the same and we are hopefully aren't.

activate is right. It is always said that the British people are pragmatists and not idealists. They distrust idealists and ideologues, that's why communism and fascism have never taken root here. They worry about anyone who is too ardent about any type of politics. They are worried about people being swept away by abstract ideas, they are pragmatists with their feet firmly on the ground.

activists can be wearing though

anyone proselytising on any cause is wearing

hence the way the majority of people used to turn their backs on the ardent socialist worker students when at university

I think UmYeahLikeTotally's mum is a bit similar.

"but when I told her about a feminist book I was reading a few months ago, all she had to say was "turning into a lefty lesbian now are you?!"It was said in a jokey way, but I know that even saying "feminism" made her very uncomfortable."

I think it is a very common reaction, because she is worried that UmYeah might turn into a loony "leftie lesbian" and that these ideas might harm her relationship in the future.

"I think that my Mum, if forced, would say that she agrees with me but it's as if she has to distance herself from feminism and from my campaigning. I have never been able to pinpoint why.

It would be lovely if my Mum could, from time to time, say that she's proud of what I do."

Jess, I think your mum is secretly proud of what you do and secretly agress with many of your views. But I think the reason that so many mums are like this is due to their concern. They think that getting into feminism will lead to harming the relationship with your DH and family and men in general. So they try to discourage you from doing it. They think feminism is dangerous, a bit like joining a sect, because it might end up harming your family life.

If you were campaigning for the Conservative Party or the Labour Party or for the Taxpayers' Alliance, then your mum would openly say that she was proud of you. But I think that feminism worries her and she tries to discourage you (even though she secretly admires you).

HerBea - off topic I know but I went to a gay bar by accident (honest) earlier and the barmen were all absolutely gorgeous, pecs and all.

So perhaps a commune with a gay bar might be nice?

God that sounds fab Wildstrawberryplace. I would so love to live in a feminist commune. But I would like men there, particularly ones with pecs. And I don't think I could countenance smoking in the kitchen, spliffs or otherwise.

(Actually I did live in a commune once, it was fab. People had jobs and worked and stuff, but there were just lots of people there. It was v. practical and affordable - but it wasn't a feminist one. (People would walk in on you when you were in the loo, in my new updated commune, I would vote for locks on the bathroom doors. )

Oh and also, I would want to establish a foolproof system for not running out of milk, loo roll or toothpaste.

My mum was part of the women's movement, I grew up surrounded by women. In fact we lived in a house populated entirely by women, no men allowed!

Some of the women were lesbians, some became lesbians "politically", and some of them gathered nightly in the kitchen to smoke spliffs and eat fried banana sandwiches and plan the counter-revolution!

My mum feels that feminism has failed or lost its way, and that part of the problem is rampant capitalism.

The effect that my upbringing had was that when I first encountered proper men free and unfettered and wandering around at university I was totally knocked for six at the fact they they actually took themselves seriously when the poor pricks were so obviously inferior to women...

Caused me no end of problems. (They fuck you up, your mum and dad, they may not mean to but they do...)

I think my mum would advocate some kind of middle way nowadays.

My mum introduced me to feminism. She used to bring home copies of Spare Rib (remember that, anyone?!) for me to read.

Most MNetters are, I guess, of an age that their mothers would have been young during the feminist resurgence of the 70s.