Traps For Women & Girls

Agree with sm and Mali.

I think Mali makes an important point as well - that perhaps it's important to bring daughters up to believe they can do whatever they want. That's something my parents did very well, they also had a strong rhetoric of doing what makes you happy being more important than anything else.

I still think I could do what I want. I haven't climbed greasy poles because I have a disabled child and feel
that any work I do has to be around him (and the other two but practically it's piss easy to sort out childcare for them compared to ds1). But that's my choice.

I can't say i've ever felt discriminated against at work. There was a very laddish sexist culture at college looking back (buy of a shame as the college had only just started admitting men) but I can't say I've come across much since then.

But I really don't give much of a damn what others think anyway. And I don't feel any need to have high status at work or be a perfect mother.

is it a leap of experience to not apply hard times and school of hard knocks to all women

yes undoubtedly sexism occurs to some women,however doesnt mean we all experience inequalities same way or same degree

so whilst of accusing me of saying not me,no siree,so unimportant.consider that just because you (or anyone else) has experienced inequality doesn't make it a given for all

this thread is fatalistic we are all fucked sentiments

And another of course for good measure

As much as we as grown women can proclaim that we don't care what anyone thinks of us (although I believe this to be bolleaux), young girls cannot say the same.

Of course they can buck the trend, fight and refuse labels assigned to them about their career, looks, promiscuity or lack thereof- but why the fuck should they have to?

Of course women reinforce dichotomies; that doesn't mean that they are responsible for inventing them.

there is no one definitive book,no one definitive message.all authors all books have agendas.i despair of the fatalistic trotting out of dysfunction and misery stats as if thats all we can look forward to

scottishmummy - I would probably have agreed with you before I read The Equality Illusion and started reading the relationships section on MN....

my job doesn't require slinky.im not disputing these things happen. i do think there is a fatalistic flavour,of life is shite we are women on this thread

Sorry, but bollocks. It's mostly just stuff in the papers, not in real life. It's just journalists trying to think of something to say and wanting to be controversial.

I don't consider myself a particularly special person, but I have never been criticised in any of the above ways. If someone did criticise me like that I would quite seriously tell them to piss off and ask them who did they think they were.

yes,thats what im getting at,some of this is fatalistic put upon poor wimmin.i dont agree with a of lot sentiments on this thread

and as arrogant to suppose all narratives apply to all women.in actuality we are all different and women arent a homogeneous group

for some those narratives will apply, for some they wont

i agree with mali sentiments.this constant diatribe of poor me poor put upon womankind.all a bit fatalistic

Malifence, what a rude, superior post that was! I don't remember saying anything was such a struggle. Just joining in the conversation.

How patronising!

but they arent traps there are stereotypical narratives.and as many folk post on mn that their sahm status is questioned and they . feel pressured to return to work.so not even necessarily applicable to all

certainly i never had pressure to be sahm,in fact after telling friends,family,colleagues i was pg the next question was when are you coming back.it was a given i would.in my experience all pg colleagues have returned

many men have pressure too- body image,perfect pecs,provider,stellar career

and pressure is applied by both genders.ive heard women bitch about so and so has arse size of a planet

maybe the biggest myth holding women back is myth of the sisterhood.alleged allegiance and solidarity based upon gender alone

i wonder if it would be such a given if it wasn''t for the pay gap, though. much as it's great to stay at home with the baby etc, i wonder if most people just go with the biggest salary keeping working?

It might be impossible to win, but in a way I believe that women do have a lot more choice than men.

I think a lot of women give themselves all the pressure.

I had a good career but hated my job. After I had my DS i worked part time and completely changed my career to something that I enjoy. My DH enjoys his job, but a lot of men are trapped in jobs that they hate, and cannot leave or retrain as they are the main breadwimmers and have a lot more pressure on them.

Also a lot of men have other pressures on them now. My friend is a beautician and has a massive increase of men coming to her for waxing as they are under pressure to be non-hairy (these are not all gay men!).

oh i don't much care what others think of me, and i was raised not to much question myself vis a vis being female etc however the older i get the more i see that if i had played a more stereotypical female game in the workplace i'd have done better, or if i'd been a male with less talent i'd have done better. so your dd may yet come a cropper, malificence, i wouldn't feel too cocky on her behalf just yet.