New Year, New Fallen Woman: Elizabeth Gaskell's Ruth Readalong

Just sticking my head round the door. I'm lurking and reading. This is a fabulous thread. I am now spending an inordinate amount of my day worrying about poor Ruth. Am almost afraid to read on. I guess that owes much to Elizabeth Gaskell's writing skills!

I enjoyed the background stories of their youth in chapter 3.
According to the ‘language of flowers’ primroses signify first love and young love. They are also associated with the Virgin Mary’s ‘pure and unblemished spirit.’
I am already feeling very angry towards Mr B!

I read Herland last year and thought it was really interesting.

So glad you enjoyed it! I just love what happens after the ‘turn’, and how the description of Gerta at the end changes. You’ll probably know Gilman’s most famous tale ‘The Yellow Wallpaper’, the title story of her short story collection, but another favourite lesser known one in there is ‘If I were a Man’ :
http://public-library.uk/ebooks/105/25.pdf

She also wrote a feminist utopian novel called Herland, which I’ve not read yet.

Interesting to read your comments. I agree Ruth is an early example of this fatal contrast that’s too tempting to predatory males, and so interesting to compare with later ‘fallen women’. I’ve not read Tess of the D’Urbervilles for ages, but my memory is also that she was warier of her newly discovered distant relative Alec, because she’s been compelled to make contact primarily for work, to help out her family while they’re in dire straits. So she’s already in a tougher, adult position of responsibility for them all. And yes, probably a bit more worldly-wise eg at her first meeting with him in Chapter 5, she initially resists the strawberry he forces into her mouth, preferring to hold it herself, as if alert to the sexual suggestiveness of his action.

I also find it interesting to compare these two characters with Gerta, in Charlotte Perkins Gilman’s brilliant feminist short story ‘Turned’ (1911). She’s an 18 year old housemaid taken advantage of by her master, and described at the start of the story as ‘a tall, rosy-cheeked baby; rich womanhood without, helpless infancy within’. What happens to her - and the other key female character - when this story ‘turns’ is remarkable. But I don’t want to spoil the ending, so if you don’t already know it, read it here for yourself: http://www.public-library.uk/ebooks/101/19.pdf

Agree about the feeling of dread at what is to come, enjoyed the description of the spring walk and the hidden primroses, enabled us to share Ruth’s feeling of a little brightness in her dark week. Having something to look forward (the trip on Sunday) makes a big difference to her week, easy for Mr B to tempt her.

Thank you @Buttalapasta

Ruth's age as well as her social position make it very clear what the power dynamic is here. Sadly it feels like a grooming scenario which could absolutely still happen today between a 23 year old man & 15 year old girl in care.

@cariadlet It was this one, I think (had a bit of a youtube binge today!). Only mentioned in passing but it was interesting.

Yes I was surprised that Ruth was only 15 and I imagined her to be around 19. Quite the age gap between them. She has a feeling she is doing wrong but I think this is her gut feeling saying that Mr B is wrong doing her. However Ruth is not listening to her conscience.

@Buttalapasta That sounds another interesting rabbit hole. Do you have a link for the YouTube video?

@TheWriteStuff , I didn't know about Ruth's name meaning rue or sorrow. Thanks for that!

I'm greatly enjoying the comments: for instance, people commenting on how rude it is for Bellingham to lecture the grandmother on how her house should be cleaner. That seems like a classic example of mansplaining. I mean, has Bellingham, as a man and an upper-class person, EVER had to do any housecleaning himself? I seriously doubt it! I see Gaskell as scoring a point for women there.

It's also a kind of conservative political mindset as opposed to a lefty one. If your house is dirty, it's not because you're poor and have untreated rheumatism and a load of childcare responsibilities, it's because you should bloody get your act together and CLEAN. God it makes me so indignant!

It is funny how serendipitous the internet is (or more likely it is just tracking what I am looking at!) but today I came across a youtube video which talked a little about how Victorian girls working in millinery was a common trope to talk about fallen women. I had no idea before reading this thread.

Lady Catherine de Bourgh in P&P is the ultimate in controlling mothers.

I have to say, I am really pleased that we have stuck with the 'fallen women' idea because I think having read the other two (plus Tess and others) it is really helpful to compare and contrast.

I know the idea of 15-16 and 23 and particularly the way he targets Ruth is unpalatable - and as far as I can see we are supposed to see him as a rake, it was really not that unusual and usually in these scenarios (the same with Natasha in W&P) in my head they present as more 18-19 but it doesnt take away from the exploitation.

I thought this was an interesting comment too.

Getting close to an animal like that is a challenge. You don’t do it for a lasting bond either, you do it for the buzz of being allowed to share a moment with them. Tun the moment of trust is over and the bond breaks, if you aren’t prepared to maintain it.
All very ominous for Ruth, if he’s the sort of guy who gets a buzz from this temporary taming.

Oh Mrs Clennam may well be it but the Emma one also rings a bell. I guess there were lots of controlling, embittered widows about.

Oh yes @ChessieFL Mrs Clennam! She was odious and very controlling.

@Piggywaspushed you might be thinking of Mrs Clennam in Little Dorrit?

Excellent summary @BishyBarnyBee and really enjoying everyone’s comments. Nothing much to add except I noted Bellingham’s comparison of Ruth to a timid fawn that he’s got to tame. She is a bit of a deer caught in the headlights isn’t she?

Alec is more obviously lascivious but Hardy's favourite word for Tess is passive. She gets carried along on the current . If anything, Tess always seems rather dim. And terribly manipulated.

I am reading an excellent book by Sarah Churchwell about the writing of Gatsby. She mentions the Bovary lipstick!

Really enjoying reading everyone's comments here. I do like how much more of an understanding we get about Ruth as compared to Anna & Emma in the previous read alongs. EG makes it really hard for the reader not to empathise with her - making sure that her 'fall' can't be dismissed as a fault of character.

Obviously, this is written as an 'issues' novel, and reflects EG's social conscience and mission to inform. But it's still a great & engaging read.

Someone asked upthread whether it was published as a serial. I don't know about Ruth specifically, but most of EG's books were serialised first. I read an excellent biog of EG some years back & one of the main things I remember was an awful lot of writing to deadlines!

Thank you @BishyBarnyBee ! I'm enjoying your summaries very much.

I was thinking of Vronsky and his mother from 'Anna Karenina'. She also doted on him, although he suited himself. I was comparing Vronsky to Bellingham. Vronsky was self-absorbed and immature and determined to get his own way and pursue Anna. The big difference is that Anna was a married woman and knew her own mind. It remains to be seen, but I suspect Bellingham is a cruel man, which I wouldn't say about Vronsky.

I would love to join you ... rather late! I was on the Anna Karenina readalong last year, but didn't contribute much. I mostly just enjoyed the comments and the wonderful summaries and used the thread to keep me on track.

I have read a couple of Elizabeth Gaskell's novels many many years ago, but not this one, so looking forward to something new.

The other thing that I found interesting was the phrases use dthen that seem to have stuck forever: a couple of things sounded quite modern. Like 'falling in love'.