Has anyone read 'I Don't Know How She Does It' or 'The Rise and Fall of a Yummy Mummy'?

I feel there's a bit of a lazy trend for educated mums to write mummy-chick-lit so they feel they are doing something worthwhile other than looking after their children. Alison Pearson is a fairly good writer anyway, so her book was funny, but some of the other stuff is dire and there's HEAPS of it in the bookshops.

I read "I Don't Know How She Does It" as did some of my former female colleagues at a big American management consulting firm.

At the time, we all heartily identified with Kate Reddy, trying to have it all (as she had been brought up - programmed - by society to think she could and should) and ultimately failing to find working that many hours a day a fulfilling lifestyle.

Of course, there a million possible scenerii for the couple relationship of a career woman and no-one will identify precisely with everything Kate Reddy went through. But I did think it was true to life of a certain sort of woman brought up to feel that she should be a high-achiever in every domain of her life and unable to see that this is physically and temporally impossible - she might be able to be very good at everything, but she can't do everything simultaneously.

I've read rise and fall, well nearly finished. I'll post when I have. I'm enjoying it. Read lots similar.

I was just teasing but I do think some stay at home mothers like to pretend it's not possible to work ful ltime and have a nice balanced family life and that is simply not true. I expect it's quite hard if you've chosen to marry a male chauvanist pig as so many silly women choose to do but not all by any means.

"couldn't hack it"?? I will not rise to that blatant insult. I think we just have different prioirities, Xenia.

Hmm, Kate Reddy. Well, wtf does she care whether other mothers think she made the mince pies or not? I wouldn't personally - I don't know any of the mums at school and couldn't give a toss what they think of me. And yes she's organised but ime working oth and sah parents are, they have to be so she's no more organised than I am. But she was given a dh who does fk all, which many of us wouldn't tolerate at all.

I think I have read the rise and fall etc but can't remember it. Bet it goes: woman has baby, feels terrible and fat. Stops having sex. Meets someone who helps her lose weight and come to terms with being mummy. BEcomes yummy mummy, starts having sex again. They all live happily ever after. Am I right?

Do I think these novels present mums realistically?

Well, 'mums' is such a huge group, as you'll see if you read mumsnet so do I think they represent a certain sub set realistically? Re working mothers, no, my experience isn't Kate Reddys but I don't work in The City and don't have a useless husband and ridiculous ideas of what makes me a decent mother a la distressed mince pies. And yummy mummy, well, I can't remember it so it must have been instantly forgettable.

As Private Eye says mummy lit is "mummmy for old rope".

IMO IDKHSDI was utter rubbish. Badly written with a crap ending. Amazed I even got to said crap ending but then I'm stubborn and can't leave a book unfinished.

n both books the writers manage to pinpoint specific aspects of mothers' lives very well. the mess in the car, the inability to get anywhere on time. That sort of thing.

The plot lines were far less convincing (and I'm using the term plot line loosly!)

And the endings of both are 'With one leap, Jack was free', utterly unconvincing.

and wheile they get tiny facets of the lives correct, I've never met a mother as stupid as either of the two lead characters

"Lots of people enjoy doing high stress city jobs whilst maintaining a high level of involvement in their children's and partner's lives, oh and having time to look after their own physical, emotional and mental wellbeing?"

Of course they do. Stay at home mothers who couldn't hack it love to think it's not possible but legions of us work full time, have lovely families and worthwhile lives.

Rachel Cusk's is about herself and she obviously found being at home with a baby very hard and I could identify with that. It's relentless domestic toil, like being an office cpeaner really but for no pay so for some of us it just doesn't suit us to do it all day but we love a little bit of it each day whether we're male or female so that's better for us and our children. Others adore it and could be nothing but a stay at home mother. Just different people. But of course there'll always be a huge market for those at home who would love to read it's hard to work full time because it helps vindicate their choice and makes them feel good. Just as I like reading novels or hearing about women like me who have always worked full time and had children.

If my daughter and I are choosing holiday reading (she's 22) she'll want me to go for the books about the 20 somethings without children and I when I was married wanted the ones about the 30 somethings with families and now I'm in mmy 40s oh dear I suppose I'll be looking for books about menopause, dealing with ageing parents and all those wondrous things I have to look forward to at my age or even a stage of life where children are irrelevant in a sense.

ALso people like to buy aspirational books - looking at what they might have or get, given how materialisitic the UK is and I'm sure part of the market is built on that.

Good luck with your thesis.

Bink - I'm inclined to agree that the ending was weak but a cop out, I'm not so sure. Perhaps I'm just feeling sensitive having recently chosen to put my city lawyering career on hold to focus on my children for a while. Never really looked at it as "copping out" before! I guess I just don't need the riptides of corporate law to invigorate my homelife/ define myself as an intelligent human being!

I read IDKHSDI after having first child and it make me LOL - especially the bit where she drops the bought mince pies onto the floor and then sprinkles icing sugar over them to make them look homemade. Although I personally couldn't compare myself to her, I have plenty of friends without children who I could imagine them being like once they did have kids. It wasn't extremely well written though and the ending wasn't great but was an ok holiday-type/just had a baby and only have a few brain cells to think about anything more intellictual read. I'm not putting it down but for me, it made me laugh and then I moved on. Some books make you 'think' for years later but this didn't.

re Kate Reddy being realistic or not - it's just that the reality of it all is just more - nuanced - than a mass-selling story can deal with. Sometimes I really whole-heartedly enjoy my City lawyering job, with its clever colleagues and big intellectual horizons, and how me doing my work seems to have an invigorating effect on relationship with dh, and time with the children, and how I get on with their teachers, and everything ... and sometimes I feel like I'm caught in a rip tide. But the fact is, it varies, and sometimes it's great and sometimes it's not, but whichever it is at any one moment it won't be the next - except that it isn't boring. Most people I know in my sort of line feel similar.

My main beef with IDKHSDI is that you have to give a book like that an ending - and she chose to send Kate off into a caramel-coloured cosy future of no rip tides. That was a cop-out I think, and exactly what conclusively plays into the media myth.

Really, KathyM? Lots of people enjoy doing high stress city jobs whilst maintaining a high level of involvement in their children's and partner's lives, oh and having time to look after their own physical, emotional and mental wellbeing? [hmmm]. I'd love to meet them.

I think Allison Pearson provides a fair portrayal of the highly educated mother trying to have/do it all. I don't think Kate Reddy is a bad mother just because she wants to be the woman that she has been educated to become.

I read this book quite recently and was suprised to find that I enjoyed it. Mummy lit ususally bores me senseless.

2 truisms that I particularly remember from the book:

1. Most city women are daddy's girls.
2. It is a waste of a woman to try to be a man.

I loved the R&F of a yummy mummy, pure escapism. Loved the rise, thought it was funny.

RAFOYM was a really really bad book!

Theheadgirl - it doesn't really show you can't have it all, because the character is only having a dreadful time because the writer decided to give her a useless dh, intolerant employer, awful in-laws etc etc, not because that's how life is for all working mothers.
Lots of people actually do do it and enjoy it

'rise and fall of a yummi mummy' could not read past page ten. not well written at all and so bloody full of stereotypical character.

'i dont know...' I enjoyed it more. yes she is a bit over the top no doubt (I hope so at leats as I dont know any mum that works in the city) but there are a lot of truths in regards to how you feel as a working mum. dunno maybe it's because it's something I am thinking a lot about ATM. (not too sure about being a SAHM but don't enjoy my job anymore as I cannot do it propeerly anymore: no time, mo brain) (sorry for rant out of place!!!)

re: those snotty comments about the subject of the dissertation and the quolity of the degree... is it necessary???

yes yes yes Helen Simpson
also, litgirl, if you would like to rip Rachel Johnson's idiot banal bandwagon Notting Hell to shreds I will gladly lend a hand. TOSH

I enjoyed "i don't know how she does it" I found some bits quite sad. It showed you really can't "have it all"

Was it fiction though Xenia?
Helen Simpson's stories from Yeah Right, Get a Life are the perfect antidote to Allison Pearson

DO look at Rachel Cusk's book on becoming a mother which was the best portrayal of new motherhood I read and reason alone for mothers to return to work ASAP in my view which usually makes everyone much happier all round.

I've read 'I don't know how she does it' and it really bugged me the way everything in the character's life is against her - husband, job, in-laws, other mums, etc etc.
Bink is quite right about it helping to create the myth.

But there is some interesting material for your own hypothesis in AS Byatt's Still Life (Stephanie and Daniel Orton)

And Posy is really good on dreary compromise. Remember the strip on "what happens to woolly liberals" - a terrible fate ... we get moth-eaten ...

Right, will stop hectoring you. I not only did an English degree, I used to supervise theses too