Sarah Waters, The Paying Guests SPOILERS!!

Weren't we supposed to be suspicious of Lillian? You just knew she was playing at love with Frances and the falseness was going to be a catalyst for serious events. Perhaps that's why her character didn't ring true.

I agree settings were great. I liked references to places in London I know.

I think Lillian as character was not as well developed as Frances. IMHO too much of the book was spent in setting the story's context nearly 40%!

I've read it and still can't decide if I liked it!

I think for me, the period stuff was great. I'm particularly drawn to books set between WW1-WW2 and this was no exception.

But I didn't take to Lillian at all. In fact, I think that's it - I liked the setting but not the characters?

I loved it. I think I loved Frances angsty awkward self consciousness like when Lilian was doing her hair an Frances was staring at the varnished wallpaper (I'm really selling it, aren't I) and I liked it when they had the argument about Lilian taking the wall.

I remember reading a book with very similar plot where the main character was "used" by the wife of the killed man in a similar manner. They had am affair. Then adter being found innocent the wife dumped the main character and git tofether with another guy.

I can't remember it's title though

I agree tshirt. I wasn't convinced at all that Lillian loved Frances in any meaningful way and Frances had definetly had the scales removed from her eyes. I would be surprised if they were still together a few years on.

I enjoyed the book and thought some of the writing was really good but I agree with others that it was a bit disjointed. I liked it much better than the Nightwatch. However i have been reading a lot of Persephone books recently and many of them are set in a similar period and are better written (but don't have same sex relationships in them). F. Tennyson Jesse's " A Pin to see the Peepshow" which Waters mentions in her research is a much superior book.

Tshirt I think that's Affinity?

I really enjoyed it but the final few pages were disappointing, I wanted to see a few years down the line what would happen with Frances and Lillian. It wasn't as gripping as fingersmith or the one about the psychic medium girl who was in prison, what was that one called? I'd like to read it again and can't find my copy.

In that case, I think I'll add TTV to my tbr list as well. If it's as good as Fingersmith then I can't wait :)

TBH I read them ages ago and have a shite memory, especially on a Friday afternoon so I can't remember!

I think I probably liked them about the same. They're quite similar in their milieus and themes, I think.

Only- which did you prefer out of Fingersmith and Tipping the Velvet? I'm halfway through Fingersmith and loving it. It twists and turns all over the place, keeping me gripped by the story

I didn't like it all that much, for similar reasons; it didn't seem to get going properly or go anywhere.

Felt a bit like two books stuck together: a social-comment piece on homophobia, class etc and a thriller/period court drama. Neither aspects were particularly satisfying, IMO.

I much prefer Fingersmith and Tipping the Velvet.

I bloody loved it, was gripped to the end - however, in retrospect, I suppose it does kind of wind down after the murder. Different tone, but I think she captures it very well - that sickening waking nightmare feeling.

Agree with hackmum that the period detail is just so amazing, and I particularly loved the class/gender stuff that Waters is so good at. Little touches like the mother wincing when she sees Frances cleaning the floor, and the posh neighbour's idea that "all the good men were killed off in the war"

I also love the absurdity of the difference between a death at home (murder), but her brothers' deaths were "legal" because they happened on the battlefield.

She's mentioned shaving legs by women, I read something on the net and indeed in the 20's women started shaving legs, book was based in 1922. Would they have already been shaving them if they were like Frances and living in Camberwell?

What I loved about it though was that the outcome of the courtroom drama was so unexpected - it seemed to be going in one direction and then ended up in another.

Actually, I loved lots of things about it, including the fantastic period detail - the way she conveyed how it felt to have so many men killed and others begging on the street. It was rather wonderful. She is rather wonderful.

a second half without any kind of murder, where it was more about Lillian and Frances overcoming all the 'normal' barriers of society, their family, their finances etc to be together

Yes, would have preferred this. Courtroom dramas are ten a penny, and this would have been more interesting (to me).

I just finished it - didn't really see the point of it, it was dragging.
What a shame as Fingersmith IMHO is one of the best books I read.

I adored Sarah Waters early books but hated the last one, thought it was pointless and now feel exactly the same about this one!
I agree the details are well drawn; I was brought up with grandparents who were born at the turn of C20th so I love this period
But this is tedious......I can't be bothered to finish it, which is very rare for me.
I guess I have to give up on Ms Waters, which is very sad

The book being atmospheric, I meant to say

I agree, Pete - Lilian's feelings were ambiguously written in that respect...Frances deserved more.

I loved it but didn't like Lilian.

Still can't decide if Lilian really loved Frances or not. In the end I felt sorry for Frances, they won't be happy.

I thought the ending was quite shocking in that they got away with it. But I do know what you mean, Southeast. And by that point I'd pretty much decided there was no future happiness for Frances and Lilian.

I finished it yesterday and enjoyed it on the whole. It was slow in parts in the first half but I mostly agree with the comments here about it being gripping, the atmosphere being atmospheric, the social commentary, and the way she built up tension was almost unbearable at times...but the ending, oh my goodness...that was so very disappointing. Some other comments on other threads saying that the posters loved the ending influenced me in that I was predicting a 'wow' of a twist - I'd also read Fingersmith, so that also made me expect a twist. But the ending was just so dull and didn't seem appropriate with the superb storytelling of what had gone before.

Really enjoyed this novel, her best yet. Fantastic atmosphere, loved the way the songs in particular built up the historical feel. Romance was top notch as usual but the crime part I felt did an excellent job in ratcheting up the tension.
Writing sublime you could really wallow in the details. Surprised to come on here and find differing opinions!

man not msn.

I thought it was very well written. Psychologically gripping. I didn't like Lillian or Len but I did like Frances, very much.
And loved all the little touches about society in London just after the Great War, the class barriers breaking down. Frances feeling conscious of her hands at a dinner, because they betray the fact that she does housework; or the young msn at the party who speaks to her, as he would never have dared to 10 years earlier.