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SEN

Here you'll find advice from parents and teachers on special needs education.

Original poster

My ds is to be excluded as there is no help for him. Also they are now looking at special needs secondary school.

60 replies

HappyNewYearFeet06 · 06/03/2008 09:52

He was down for a mainstream secondary and it was named on his statement. From a meeting at school last night I found out that his helper that he has within the classroom has resigned and is leaving tomorrow and that when she has left there is no other help and so he will have to be excluded should anything go wrong and that will build up to a permanent exclusion. As for secondary in Sept, they are now saying he won't cope with mainstream and will need something else. The Ed Psych has named a school that has spaces but I have been told about this school and haven't heard good things. So where do I go from here????

Thanks. xx

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Original poster
HappyNewYearFeet06 · 06/03/2008 13:55

Thansk guys. Nothing in part 3 although that is where I got the paragraph about his severe and complex needs.

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dustystar · 06/03/2008 13:29

I don't know what that is either. I really think you should contact IPSEA and ask their advice. They were really helpful when i had problems with ds old school.

dustystar · 06/03/2008 13:27

In part 3 of ds statement there is a line which states that he has low incidence needs. This means that his particular needs are not very common and therefore the school only need to fund 5 hours of his support as the LEA will fund the rest. If he was classed as having high incidence needs it would mean that his needs were much more likely to be seen in other children and the school then has to fund the first 15 hours of support.

Original poster
HappyNewYearFeet06 · 06/03/2008 13:26

One paragraph says that his statement will be maintained whilst his needs remain severe and complex and beyond Step 3 of HCC SEN Audit criteria.

But doesn't explain what this is.

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Blandmum · 06/03/2008 13:20

My questions for the MS school would be what will happen to your son in 'unstructured' times, like break and lunch time. IME this can be a particularly difficult time for children with ASD/ADHD. Will they provide him was a 'safe haven'

Do you think that his currenet school is trying to get him more support by forcing the issue with the LEA via exclusion?

FWIW I have seen children with a similar dx to your son to very, very well on MS, provided they got enough support. Others, who didn't, fell between the cracks

Original poster
HappyNewYearFeet06 · 06/03/2008 13:17

dustystar, what do you mean from high or low incidence needs? Just trying to read through but its baffling!

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Original poster
HappyNewYearFeet06 · 06/03/2008 13:15

dx?? Are you asking what his diagnosis is? I assume so. He has ADHD with autistic traits.

The mainstream school is approx 1000 pupils whereas looking at special schools they tend to be around 75-150 max pupils. I have yet to go and have a look and speak with them about how they would deal with ds once he is there and that is something I really need to do next week.

The special school suggested sounds awful, I have looked at the Ofsted report and also word of mouth.

I don't know whether just to push on with mainstream and see what haoppens once he is there???

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dustystar · 06/03/2008 13:13

Ok - does it say anywhere whether he has high or low incidence needs? This determines how much support the school is required to fund from their own budget.

Original poster
HappyNewYearFeet06 · 06/03/2008 13:12

Ds will require an educational setting where he can recieve some 1:1 as well as small group support from staff skilled and experienced in providnig programmes of support to pupils withb challenging behaviour, whilst having access to a mainstream environment. Within a mainstream school he will recieve 15 hours per week learning support assistance from the school and local authority budgets, in accordance with the current local authority regulations.

This is what it states in his statement amongst other things.

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Original poster
HappyNewYearFeet06 · 06/03/2008 13:06

ok, got it, sorry if this is going to be long!

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Blandmum · 06/03/2008 13:06

sorry to be dim, but what is his dx?

How big is the school he is going to go to, and how much provision will he have there?

Does the school have a good reputation in dealing with children with his difficulties?

What are the scpecial school options like?

Original poster
HappyNewYearFeet06 · 06/03/2008 13:03

I am unsure. If he can't cope in mainstrwam primary without a TA then how is going to cope with all of his different books, places to be, lessons etc..... in a school of up to 1000. Everyone keeps saying that once he gets to secondary they won;t have any of his misbehaving etc.... but if he is statemented and has a recogniseable condition then surely its understandable that he is going to sometimes behave differently and may need extra help?? Our local secondary that I put his name down for does have a good special needs department comapred to other local schools.

Just off to dig out his statement.

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dustystar · 06/03/2008 12:59

Well its possible she actually is trying to help him then but if thats the route she's taking she shouldn't be doing it without discussing it with you first. My mum is a SENCo and she often says about how frustrating it is when you support a child so they acheive and then the LEA refuse to fund the school so that they can continue the support. Sometimes an exclusion seems to be the only thing that gets the LEA to agree to decent funding.

Have you read through his statement yet?

Blandmum · 06/03/2008 12:56

Do you feel that he will make progress in MS school? Or do you think he would be better in a special school (you are the expert here)

Original poster
HappyNewYearFeet06 · 06/03/2008 12:52

They aren't really using the loss of the TA as such but is going to have a knock on affect on his behaviour by not having one there, iykwim.

So as the TA isn't there to support him his behaviour may worsen and as such they will have reason to exclude him for a fived time of 2 days the head said. Then she was saying that she was hoping to exclude him enough times for it to be a permanent exclusion as it would 'help him' to get the help he needs???????

She said that morally it didn't feel right and she didn't want to do it but had the backing from the Ed Psych from the meeting last night?

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Blandmum · 06/03/2008 12:47

Yes they should. But I think that they would be granted 'reasonable' time to do that. There isn't (AFAIK) a 'supply' organisation for TAs in the same way there is for teachers.

they have a legal dulty to replace the TA (as well as a moral one!), but that will (even if they were doing all the right things, which it doesn't sound as if they are) take time. I would have thought a minimum of 2 weeks.

Awful situation, and that can't use the loss of the TA as an excuse to exclude

dustystar · 06/03/2008 12:42

They would need to find a replacement though wouldn't they MB? Even if its a temp TA while they find a permanent replacement.

Blandmum · 06/03/2008 12:41

I'm not sure about this, but i don't think that TAs have to give the same amount of notice as teaching staff. (I'm sure some of the TAs on MN will be able to clarify this)

Original poster
HappyNewYearFeet06 · 06/03/2008 12:38

She gave 2 weeks notice and is due to leave tomorrow but the headteacher said this morning that she has said she will stay on until Easter.

Am off to double check his statement.

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cornsilk · 06/03/2008 12:35

This situation is the fault of the school management. The helper would surely have had to give notice to resign. The Head and the Governors are at fault here.

dustystar · 06/03/2008 12:34

Does it state how many hours of support he should get? They have to provide some. they can't just say he has to do without if its in his statement. They will have to find someone else in the school to support him until they employ a replacement.

DS is only 7 but his TA left last year and the school didn't find a permanent replacement before she went (which i was a bit pissed off about) but they did give him a temporary 1:1 for a couple of weeks until they found a replacement. They had to as his statement states that he gets 25 funded hours of support from the LEA and the school must provide a further 5 hours from their budget.

Original poster
HappyNewYearFeet06 · 06/03/2008 12:29

Yes, his statement says that he needs the extra support and am sure it says he needs smaller group time too. They are going to readvertise for a new support assistant but until then he is on his own unless the school can call upon someone already within the school but they have said that is unlikely.

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Blandmum · 06/03/2008 12:13

If he has classroom support as part of his statement the school is legally required to supply it

coppertop · 06/03/2008 12:12

That's awful. Please don't let them get away with this. The statement is a legal document and they have to provide the help. Contact the LEA asap.

needmorecoffee · 06/03/2008 12:11

they are breaking the law. They must provide what his stamenet says and no child can be excluded cos they have SN.
What the head is saying is wrong, if its his SN that lead to the head axcluding him then its discrimination. As Edam says, the Heads plan breaks the law.