to think her behaviour is tearing apart our family?

Fully agree with PPs about reward system, the other thing that's really great for kids struggling with time management is something called the Big Red Clock (I think?) Which is a visual clock - they can see the time reducing - I have a younger brother with Asperger's and a sister on the Autistic Spectrum and my mum bought the clock for them.. but it helped all my siblings in the mornings! As it's a visual representation of time actually ticking away. I'll see if I can find a link.

My DD is younger but we’ve had massive behaviour problems- all linked to tummy issues and dairy intolerance- what’s her diet like? We’ve cut dairy out and it’s massively improved the issue. Might be worth looking into?

Sounds to me like ASD, first thing I thought. High functioning Autistic girls often present very differently to boys with the same condition.

Behaviour is communication

I wholly agree with this. Something is bothering her, some need is being unmet. Sometimes getting to the bottom of the issue is not as easy as we'd think. So I'd recommend active listening - ahaparenting.com is great for articles and advice on how to communicate with kids, and get to a place where they trust you enough to open up. Hard work, but transformative.

Also, have you heard of 'Simplicity Parenting'? It's a book mostly about reducing the amount of stimulation and stuff in a child's environment/day, but also about routine and regularity and boundaries, and how reassuring that can be for a kid. Might be useful.

As I read the first few paragraphs I thought "she sounds just like my autistic 11 year old". My child can dress herself but if I want to get out of the door in a timely manner, she needs help.

I would research autism in girls and respond as if she is with the various techniques you could use and see if it makes an impact.

Out of interest, why does it have to be autism or ASD? She could just be an absolutely pain in the arse 🤷🏻‍♀️

I think you need to report the thread and say in the box that comes up where you want it to go

Btw, kindness wasn’t me being judgemental - I read that back and realised how it could come across. What I mean is that she needs to see everyone around her being kind because when this stuff spirals everything and everyone gets spiky and hard and the kindness starts to go; everyone starts to become on edge waiting for the next meltdown or kick off, including her.

That’s what I meant. Although I’m not sure I’ve done any better trying to explain it there either actually! 🤦🏻‍♀️

You could try making her sleep in the next days clothes. She can either put them on the night before or in the morning. I'd also take her in her pjs. Tell her she can explain it to the teacher. If you do let get dressed in the morning I'd make sure she gets dressed before she comes downstairs. None of mine come down on a school day in pjs. Another tactic is move through the morning together. Get dressed with her. Lay your clothes out in her room and do it at the same time. Race her. Make it silly. You've just got to break the pattern of resistance.

DD is 8, nearly 9

Both my DD were suddenly full of attitude then - DS bit later. Felt awful at the time.

Though I was probably still prodding them along at bed time and in mornings at that age - still working towards them being independent - reminding them what they were supposed to be doing and periodic checks that they were doing it - setting up routines for future.

Probably worth looking into ASD - maybe trying some of the de-escalating techniques you know on her see if there's any effect.

I remember shocking my parents by suddenly answering back rudely at around 9/10. I had recently made a new friend and that’s how she spoke to her parents. I’d been shocked to hear her family interact but it did rub off somehow and I suppose I tried it out at home in the heat of being told off for something - might be unrelated but just a thought.

I’m Surprised so many people are jumping to ASD when 8 almost 9 is within the normal range for the beginning of puberty and the beginning of hormonal surges. Especially as you say this behaviour has come about in the last few months.

I remember having a full on breakdown in school when I was 10 over a really trivial matter and the teacher explaining to my mum she saw it all the time at this age from kids who’ve never acted out before.

No words of wisdom I’m afraid, I think it’s a phase that has to be weathered with a mixture of compassion and appropriate punishment for bad behaviour.

Oh, and if you look into it and do think PDA May be a possibility don’t do things like set up Alexa reminders or give countdowns or set conditions - the demand and expectation inherent in all those things will absolutely 100% make it worse

Look into ADHD, and the PDA profile of autism.

Try following PDA pages on fb and using their suggestions about using declarative language. You can already see the things which are flashpoints, so you’re on your way to addressing this, and the ways you are trying to deal with them as escalating the behaviours you don’t want to see. So you already know what doesn’t work. This is good.

So my advice (from bitter, bitter experience): stop seeing how she’s behaving as ‘won’t’ and start seeing it as ‘can’t’. That doesn’t mean you can’t have boundaries, but it does mean your focus shifts.

Move this over to the SEN section because you’re going to get a lot of advice if you leave it here about enforcing even tighter and stricter boundaries which will not help.

My guess is that she needs kindness, low demand, probably going backwards by several steps in terms of ‘ability’ - if this is ASD or PDA then anxiety will be a huge underlying factor and giving her some form of control will be enormously helpful.

Message me if you like.

I agree with asd possibilities especially in girls it presents differently.
Set up a reward for the next day, including her usual fun activity.
Went to bed well equals half hours on iPad etc.
Got dressed quickly equals fifteen min on iPad
Ready at the door equals fifteen minutes.

Set her up for success though.
Get Alexa to remind her at specific times, get her to get dressed when she gets up, so at the worst she's ready to leave without breakfast. Maybe have a breakfast bar or toast In the car.

Is it possible she's experiencing pre-pubertal hormonal changes? My 14yr old ASD son was hideous at times from age 10, his NT sister is just beginning this phase - all the toddler moody reactions, kicking her siblings over the least slight, many behaviours she stopped long ago are now her go-to. I am trying to give her one-on-one time, lots of positive reassurances when things go well, telling her sorry after I end up yelling, and generally doing what I can when I have the strength for it. In summary, it may be normal changes, but I also think it may be worth considering what PPs have said about a possible diagnosis.

Yup, sounds like ASD is a possibility. It sounds very familiar - I can remember those days and I still have a lot of trouble getting out in the morning. My psychiatrist definitely agrees that my executive disfunction is bad enough to be disabling. Has she always been trouble at bedtime, ie is this new, or just ramped up?

Have you asked her what she thinks would help her go to bed and get ready in the morning? What motivates her? Did something happen over Christmas or is she hiding something from you?

I read about ten lines into your post and thought ASD. I am autistic, as is my daughter, and to the outside world we seem clever, reasonable and delightful. But when pushing into doing things at home we can both be spitfires and it is usually as a result of simple, repetitive tasks that we do all the time. I could have written your post about the morning routine for my DD when she was that age.

I was also going to suggest PDA. I think DD has it although she can seem very helpful when it suits her.

Ha, ha, ha,ha...

So sorry op, heard it so many times. Age 9ish some of them turn into right little buggers.. seems to be a hormone surge. ( Happens in boys too)

Add to that age 9 ISH is when dd's autism became more obvious

And yeah, we are four years into the getting dressed in the morning is a surprise and it is all my fault.

You do have my sympathy despite the laughter... it is the sort of laughter of bitter experience.