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Original poster

To give up on my son's school?

134 replies

jaffacakesaremyfave · 04/07/2017 13:51

My 8 year old DS has severe behavioural problems at school. In the past 2 years he has been excluded more times than I can count, been put on a reduced timetable once for 3 months and recently again for an indefinite period (so he's currently excluded every Friday)

His reception year at school was fine but when he moved into year 1, the problems started. We relocated due to my work and he moved school when he was at the end of year 1 and things really began to deteriorate.

He had a bad start due to racial bullying which I don't feel the school took seriously and as his behaviour became worse, they resorted to locking him in a small room until he calmed down but would often leave him there until I came to collect him even when he had calmed down.

I fought to get him into a better school which was run by the same head teacher where his older brother attends and for the first term his behaviour improved dramatically. However, over the last year we seem to be back to where we started.

The most recent incident was yesterday where he left school premises (he's never done this before) and the school rang the police. They only called me after he had gone back into school and said they called the police as they are unable to follow him when he leaves school grounds. The police never came so basically if he does this again they will leave my 8 year old son to wander around a busy main road until the police arrive.

I feel at my wits end and I don't know how things can move forward. I have had so many meetings with the school to try and manage his behaviour. He has a teaching assistant and he is extremely fond of his current class teacher but his behaviour deteriorates if neither of them are in school (like yesterday when both were at sports day all day). Next year will be horrendous as he already doesn't like his new teacher for year 4.

I've tried to get him referred to CAHMS several times through both the school and GP but these have led nowhere. His main problems seems to be about becoming frustrated if he can't do his work or if he is told off for something that he feels is unjust (like being told off for talking in class when it wasn't him talking) This leads to him either completely shutting down and becoming mute for hours on end or become destructive and swearing at teachers.

At home he is generally well behaved but we have a very close relationship and I have learned how to ask him to do things in a way that avoids conflict and if things escalate then I know how to calm him down and he always accepts his punishments (e.g losing his electrics, pocket money, can't go to football etc)

I recently had a meeting with someone from parent partnership who attended a meeting with the head and she agreed that some of the things the school were doing were not helpful (e.g if my son walked off they would tell him he's going to a PRU or back to the previous school for which they also run).

He has witnessed DV when he was very young from his father (who is now in prison and he no longer sees) and i found out last year that their father was emotionally abusing him and his brothers (which never made it to trial).

I have asked for counselling but nowhere can provide it for free so my only option is private which I can't afford. The school made a referral to a charity for young carers (after me pushing for a year to try and find an organisation that can help him) but they only offer an outing after school every fortnight and it really isn't set up for children like my son who have behavioural issues.

I've been to CAHMS in the past and done the 6 week parenting course but like I say, his behaviour at home isn't the issue and CAHMS won't deal with behavioural problems.

I feel like the school has given up on him and labelled our family as 'one of those families'. They are extremely patronising to me (comments such as 'well you do so well getting them to school looking clean' etc.)

Not that it should make a difference to how we are judged but although I am a single parent, I have always worked, have a high level of education and am in a professional career but they still seem to treat me like I'm some silly single mother who has messed up her child and assume I'm at home on benefits.

Sorry for the long post but I really do not know where to go from here. Should I move his school for a third time to one not affiliated with this one or leave my son in a school not able to manage his behaviour and potentially letting him leave the premises and not be followed.

Where do I stand legally with their position on this? Surely they have a duty of care to ensure he is safe during school hours and if they cannot manage that then they should call me immediately so I can intervene.

I am so exhausted and upset by this situation

OP posts:
Original poster
jaffacakesaremyfave · 06/07/2017 09:22

I've just found a list of the last meeting discussion points that I sent to the person from parent partnership and some of it I had forgotten.

my concerns about the use and number of 'unofficial' exclusions. DS3 was excluded for 3 months unofficially last year at last school and on several further occasions (I've lost count). This prevents the number of days he has been excluded from being monitored. I've been asked on occasion if he can be marked as sick (I was told this was so it wouldn't go in his record) rather than excluded which I refused.

  • the use of the holding room to calm DS3 down and how long he is left in there for
  • the 'threat' of going back to Old school and PRU as a means of punishment for DS3 and DS2. This has been threatened for over a year now for DS3
  • the male member of staff (head teachers brother) telling DS2 he 'won't last five minutes at new high school with this behaviour' when DS2 was clearly upset. I felt this was inflammatory and particularly mean as he had only found out that day that his place at new high school had been accepted.
  • DS3 being told he won't get into college with his bad behaviour (not sure which member of staff said this).
  • making DS2 watch a PE lesson outside because he forgot his kit and saying this was because 'he always forgets it so we didn't let him borrow one this time'
  • not allowing DS3 to stay in at breaktime, resulting in him have a meltdown (he didn't want to play outside at breaktime as was anxious that day). Can something be put into place to manage this.
  • what support is currently in school for both children and what more can be done?
  • What help is DS2 getting for his dyslexia and are either on the SEN register.
-? Counselling for both boys

All we achieved from the above discussions was both my DS being referred to young carers.

OP posts:
Original poster
jaffacakesaremyfave · 06/07/2017 08:51

Thank you roll, I'm going to print this out and bring it to the meeting with a big fat highlight of social, emotional and mental health!!

OP posts:
rollonthesummer · 05/07/2017 21:05

Ooh, that didn't work!

www.nasen.org.uk/utilities/download.29628CBA-F6C6-4F3E-87EE43D23B1F757E.html

rollonthesummer · 05/07/2017 21:05

Read the top of page 4

[[http://www.nasen.org.uk/utilities/download.29628CBA-F6C6-4F3E-87EE43D23B1F757E.html]]

Original poster
jaffacakesaremyfave · 05/07/2017 18:33

Thanks for the list Can't, it's very helpful. I will look into doing my own referral.

I've been meeting with the head. Any work with the SENCO is passed on second hand via the head. The meetings are usually following incidents with my son where I have either been asked to come in or I have requested a meeting and we make a plan going forward. The SENCO is not in attendance at these meetings

The school does not think my son has SEN, it's all labelled as behavioural which is maybe why there is minimal SENCO involvement

OP posts:
rollonthesummer · 05/07/2017 17:50

Who have you been having meetings with if not the Senco?!

Ceto · 05/07/2017 17:14

OP, emotional problems which result in your child being repeatedly excluded and put on a part time timetable are definitely educational needs, without question. If you don't get immediate agreement on Monday to apply for an EHC Plan, please go ahead and do it yourself. Phone IPSEA or SOS SEN for help.

Cantchooseaname · 05/07/2017 11:13

Posting on the special needs board will give you loads of advice about ehcp.

Things I would want to discuss with school:

  • what strategies are being used to support him? These should be on paper so that everyone who comes into contact with him is clear and consistent- i.e. If regular staff are away.
  • what paper trail are they collecting- any future support will depend on proving he has issues at school- it would be good to see now what paper work they have relating to previous incidents, and how these point to a pattern. Is it always/ usually with other staff? If so, can there be an option for him to do something different for those days?
  • where I worked any pupil requiring physical intervention would have a positive handling plan. Different places call them different things, however they should contain the same kind of info- what strategies are used to deescalate/ diffuse a situation? What specific holds/ moves can be used (this must be agreed by you, and preferably him). There is a heirachy of intervention- starting with steering a child away and working up to physical holds involving multiple people. The last section of any positive handling plan relates to debrief. Everyone involved sits down after the event- maybe after an exclusion, maybe just once things are calm. The discussion isn't about blame/ shaming, it's about why interventions were used, and what could be done different next time. There should be a paper trail.
In a crisis, staff can do whatever they need to keep him/ themselves safe, as long as it is reasonable- but repeated incidents is not a crisis response. Subsequent interventions should be planned.
  • exclusions- make it clear you are on same page as them in terms of supporting deserved exclusions, and that to support this work should be sent home.
  • timetable/ action plan for returning to full timetable. You need to be clear that he is entitled to full time education, which is their responsibility.
  • transition arrangements for new class for September. There's lots that can be done to make this easier.

Schools are hard places at the moment. There isn't enough money, time and people. That doesn't mean your son should suffer. They have a legal responsibility to do right by him.

Good luck!!

Crochetthedayaway · 05/07/2017 11:01

Your Senco should be at the meeting, my ds has handwriting issues and was assessed and put on the register without us having to ask, we have yearly meetings with senco and class teacher without having to ask. You are not getting outstanding support.

Original poster
jaffacakesaremyfave · 05/07/2017 08:17

Thanks everyone. I'm going to ask if the SENCO can attend the meeting on Monday (she's never attended them before) and I always get second hand information about her involvement.

In regards to the EHC, the website states 'Remember you can only ask for an EHC needs assessment if the child or young person has or may have educational needs – it does not apply where there are only health and/or care needs no matter how severe.'

If he has emotional problems do these not fall under health/care needs?

I'm at work today and tomo but I'm going to take him to the Gp and ask for a referral to a psychiatrist.

OP posts:
rollonthesummer · 05/07/2017 07:37

Of the 31 children on my SEN register, only 5 have ever been seen by the EP. If your son is on a reduced timetable, that implies a serious problem in accessing learning-ask why, if it's serious enough for him not to be in school full time, why is it not serious enough for him to be on their SEN register.

Ask to see a copy of the school's SEN Information report and ask what their policy says about deciding when children go on the SEN register using the graduated response?

Go to the GP today and ask for a referral to a paediatrician.

Enquire about local private EPs online.

Ceto · 05/07/2017 07:36

OP, you really need to apply for an Education, Health and Care needs assessment - details of how to do it here - www.ipsea.org.uk/what-you-need-to-know/ehc-needs-assessments/asking-for-an-ehc-needs-assessment. If your child is constantly being excluded and put on part time timetables, he clearly qualifies.

If you need help with this, call IPSEA or SOS SEN.

Ceto · 05/07/2017 07:34

Reduced timetables are legal but need to be agreed by parents and are not long term.

No, they aren't, except for children who have to be out of school for medical reasons. By law children must have full time education. There is recent case law that says that if a school puts a child with SEN on a part time timetable, it is guilty of disability discrimination if it does not arrange something like home tuition to meet the child's right to full time education.

Original poster
jaffacakesaremyfave · 05/07/2017 07:21

*Yellow,
*
How do I get the school to put him on the SEN register?

Can anyone help me make a list of things to ask for for the meeting on Monday and who should be providing these?

The schools standard response is that there isn't an EP to do assessments to get him in the SEN and I often find my suggestions are dismissed during our meetings so I need to have answers for everything they may throw back at me.

Getting my son the help he needs should be this hard. It feels like a battle and yes, I just need one person to really take hold of the situation and help our family.

OP posts:
Original poster
jaffacakesaremyfave · 05/07/2017 07:17

Thank you for all the links. I'll try to get through them all today.

It appears my local LA try to enforce disciplinary action on our head of the AEP for raising concerns about the lack of EP's in our area.

There really is only one serving the whole LA.

'The principal issue concerns the treatment of our elected LA Representative when he raised the issue of (LA's) failure to recruit to the vacant Principal Educational Psychologists position following the retirement of the previous incumbent at the end of March 2015.'

Fucking Tories indeed Yellow!!!**

I have looked into for play therapy and whether any referrals can be made to an organisation that offers this. There is nothing in my area.

I'm starting to accept that I'm going to have to pay for my son to get the help he needs rather than relying on the school or charities. I don't really have the money for this but have no options left

OP posts:
ElfrideSwancourt · 04/07/2017 23:01

Have you considered taking him to see a play therapist? Child in my class currently seeing one for similar issues and it's definitely helping.

yellowsun · 04/07/2017 22:48

Your child should be on the SEN register under 'SEN support'. They do not have to have an EHCP for this (this would be listed differently).

yellowsun · 04/07/2017 22:46

Having googled after your PM, I found some information about poor working conditions for educational psychologists in the LA and how there are fears that there are not enough members of staff to carry out the EHCP assessments let alone anything else. Fucking tories.

rollonthesummer · 04/07/2017 22:33

Roll, there really is only one EP for the whole LA and as Yellow said, it's only for children who need assessing for SN register.

That makes no sense to be honest, but if that's what you've been told, you can reply that your child needs assessing for the SEN register!

JsOtherHalf · 04/07/2017 21:56

www.team-teach.co.uk/Doc01_code%20March%202015.pdf

Original poster
jaffacakesaremyfave · 04/07/2017 21:29

Beader, I would have absolutely no problems with them restraining him to prevent him leaving school premises. I also have no problem when he has the potential to hurt himself or others. My issue is that I haven't even been asked for consent and I'm unsure about specially trained staff which others posters mentioned.

If you read my OP, my issue is more with the cupboard than the restraints. It is very rare that this happens as his main issue is selective mutism and absconding

OP posts:
BeaderBird · 04/07/2017 21:19

You'd complain if they were to physically restrain him when he tries to leave though, right?

ASauvingnonADay · 04/07/2017 21:18

They call it 'team teaching' and yes they used to physically put him in the room. They still physically restrain him and I've never seen paperwork for this or consented.
Team teach is about de-escalation, but does use types of restraint. Schools are allowed to use reasonable force by law if it is appropriate and proportionate.

ASauvingnonADay · 04/07/2017 21:17

I'm not sure 'assessing for SN register' means very much. Your child needs an assessment! Can you complain/write higher up? It seems absolute madness that they won't do it.

Cantchooseaname · 04/07/2017 21:16

Ofsted see and measure what they want.
You need somewhere that gets him, and will invest the time he needs.
You may find the school in a 'tougher' area attracts teacher who can see passed that and are keen to go the extra mile. Or hey may have whatever teachers they can convince to come through the door.