Scottish Referendum debate - watch with Mumsnet

I don't know. Genuinely - I think we could see a swing either way. There's a bit of an assumption that in independent Scotland would be more socialist than the rest of the UK but I'm unconvinced. My own opinion is that it would depend hugely on how the separation went and we could just as easily swing to the right if things aren't going well and we find ourselves in a recession. Especially with issues like anti immigration sentiment - there is a reasonable amount of that here I think and if, say, our FS industries tanked and we had bad unemployment a more right wing party could make gains.

I suppose I'm not convinced that Scots are these entirely different socialist generous beings who have a very different leaning to the rest of the UK. It could be we just have a (collective) long memory and hate the blooming tories with a passion

"I'd need to check the figures but I'm pretty sure that in the last election Scotland did make a difference - I think without Scotland it would be a tory majority. Mind you, with the current parties it's like "chose which colour of tory you would like, blue red or orange!""

It may have stopped a majority, and yes they are all much of a muchness.

I don't disagree that there's not an issue with deciding how small you slice up the vote before everyone's represented either.

But it's still not the same as voting individually for a party that loses an election, my vote pretty much doesn't count anyway as I live in a very safe seat, but it's still not the same.

"chose which colour of tory you would like, blue red or orange!"

Do you think that might change if there was a yes vote? Greens are popular in our local area and they do seem to be gaining momentum, I think an independent Scotland would benefit a party such as the Greens, which personally I see as a good thing.

Anyway too tired to think much longer - night!

My issue with the "not who we voted point" is, generally, how small do you keep slicing? Orkney and Shetland have never voted SNP...should they declare independence?

I think it probably depends on whether you consider yourself as Scottish, British, both...IME my vote carries the same weight as anyone else in Britain. I don't feel hard done by as a result.

I'd need to check the figures but I'm pretty sure that in the last election Scotland did make a difference - I think without Scotland it would be a tory majority. Mind you, with the current parties it's like "chose which colour of tory you would like, blue red or orange!"

So what happens if the central belt vote one way and other areas of Scotland vote another? Does the north of England always get the government they vote for? I suppose it comes down to whether or not you think Scotland is going to overwhelmingly vote in one particular way.

The Scotland getting the government they vote for point...

It's not the same at all as an individual voting for a party that loses, every single voter in Scotland could have voted labour (or any party except conservative) in the last election and it would not have affected the outcome of the general election.

More than 90% of Scottish MP can vote against something in the House of Commons and it is passed anyway.

So realistically Scotland gets the government that the rest of the UK votes in and is then reliant on MPs representing other parts of the country to make decisions.

That's very very different to one person voting for a losing party.

Although I have to say as a debate it was pretty disappointing, not well run at all.

Did you manage to catch any online helensburgh? Poor show from Border. Strange that we get loads of regional BBC options on Freesat but not ITV.

Such a shame some of us in Scotland , in itv border region, weren't deemed worthy enough by itv border for them to buy this debate.

Central belt power again

Glaikit, I too have been party to such conversations, it is only prudent for them to consider the options and the implications for their business. I think some have been quite open about this in the media.

I can't link to sources I'm afraid GlaikitFizzog - my info is based on conversations etc which I've been party too in a professional context. But I do personally know of several very large FS companies who will almost certainly move a significant portion of their operations south in the period after a yes vote.

Narrow minded? On a proportional basis the majority of their clients will be south of the border so from a public perception perspective there could well be strong pressure for them to move. Then you have the practical financial and regulatory aspects. My understanding is that how those will pan out for in iScotland is that they're totally up in the air at the moment for two major reasons:

1. Currency/Currency Union/Central Bank
2. European Union

The answers to those will probably dictate what happens with financial services. Issues like what capital and regulatory regime the banks and insurance companies would find themselves operating under are huge.

So annoying that all the post debate 'pundits' are men. Come on TV channels!

Back up your facts please lady? If all of Scotland's financial services head south, is t that a little narrow minded of them? There will still be a financial sector in Scotland.

I don't think that's a fair metaphor Sirchenjin : in such a case, you'd be given (or provide) a proposed contract with the details outlined and you'd negotiate any details you didn't agree on before making an informed decision. But at the moment, Westminster refuses to even contemplate that Scotland might vote Yes and says it hasn't made any plans if it does.

The panda/alien stuff was a bit ill advised.

It was all a bit shit tbh.

It's the same script. Norway, oil, starving children. Alex could have gone home and I could read his script! And if he quoted something Alistair Darling said once, he quoted him a hundred times!! I've never seen a man who could waffle on and still say nothing like him ! As for pandas, outer space and driving on the right hand side...... Cringeworthy!!!

Alex perfers the "och it'll all be smashing, so it will" approach to independence, as opposed to actually answering the questions.

It's a bit like this - supposing you were Deputy Manager of a shop within a chain, and you were offered the chance to manage your own shop. You wouldn't just sign on the dotted line, would you - you would want to know what your pay would be, what pension you would get, would hours you would be expected to work, how you would operate with that chain and so on and on. It's a bit like that with independence - as Statistically says, there will be people who will accept any terms in order to manage their own country (or shop), but there will be many, many more who want to know exactly what they are signing up to - and that's just not happening at the moment in the Yes campaign.

I didn't feel that either of them covered themselves in glory

I'm still waiting to find out just why we're "better together"? Being bigger isn't (in my opinion) an answer as there are plenty of countries that are the same size as or smaller than Scotland who are successful as countries and who don't have the resources that we are blessed with.

He doesn't have an alternative. He thinks because he wants it to happen it will! Everybody's out of step but our Alex.......