How do you appeal against your school placement? My friend's face is purple from crying. I really need to help her.

Also worth looking at the appeals section of the elevenplusexams website - lots of case histories and good advice, plus active forum - best of luck!

Hi, and so sorry to hear of your friends situation. I worked as an admistrator on school appeals, although it was a good 15 years ago. However, the ones that won, were the ones with extenuating circumstances. if your friends child has been bullied then use that, perhaps get evidence from the primary school. Dont criticise the school they have been offered - this is always a fatal mistake. Just say why, in positive terms, the school they want would be better.

Glad to hear it worked out well in the end.

I recently won my appeal. I was going to get a lawyer to represent me, but it was just to expensive. I actually got a lot of help from this school appeal advice website which allows you to get 121 advice for free. Saved myself a fortune.

Nice to hear some good news. So pleased for your friend!

Just a last post, tks for everyones help, we won our appeal, use all same reasons for Copthall but maybe it was my nerves or because it was our first choice - It was accepted.

Good luck to anyone else still trying.

Sue

Tks Violetqueen

It is an Academy so I'll check it out in case I have to go to appeal.

Umm ,just tossing this in ,in case it helps anyone .
If the school you want to get into is an Academy ,it might be worth checking the Funding Agreement ( google with school name ) .
You may find ,as applies to some ,that they have a clause that allows them to
" set a higher admission number as its Published Admission Number for any specific year ".
The Academy would probably have to consult the LA over this ,but you might be able to argue that there is scope to admit even if full.
The clause might be in a supplement or appendix to main doc.

Well I've spoken to my primary head and he will support our appeal - he suggests multiple appeals to three of the four schools we listed.

I also today found out my daughter (at present, it could change) is 13th on the waiting list for our first choice school!
However the school only offers 80 'community'
places.

I really don't know if I can expect or not.

Went to see the allocated school yesterday, it's not too bad but I still worry about the difficult journey. Still going to appeal!

Anyone any idea if 13th is good, bad or indifferent???

Tks
Sue

In terms of schools taking excluded pupils, our LA does what's called a 'managed move' which means that we swap kids between us rather than permanently exclude. It sometimes works, as it gives the kids a fresh start.

No help to any of you, I know.

If it's any help, I know someone who won an appeal to get her kids into a school near to her workplace rather than her home. She won the appeal based on the fact that if they didn't admit her sons, they would be discriminating against her for being a working parent. This may help some people, especially the poster who said she can't get her DC to school and get to work on time.

With regard to the excluded pupil, there is something called the Fair Access Protocol. This in effect means that any pupil that is permanently excluded will go to another relatively local school and that all schools, even if they are up to their admission number have to take their fair share of such pupils. The school will not have had any say in whether they could refuse them, the LA simply will instruct the school to take the pupil, that is the law.

I was in this position this time last year - we were not offered any of our 3 'choices'. We went to appeal and won.

I spent the 2 months between allocation day and the appeal doing my homework! And I rehearsed my speech constantly (when on my own in the car).

I did masses of research re the size of the school, year groups, expansion both planned and existing. I got the audit reports etc from the County. I'd say don't be intimidated by the panel as you probably know more about the school than they do!

I used lots of terminology such as Â?class size prejudiceÂ?. I also Googled the chair of the panel, I think it helped a bit to see what she looked like before we went in (she was definitely Â?bad copÂ? on the day!).

Finally, you need to find things about the school you want that other schools don't offer. Anything!

You need to prove that either your child would be prejudiced by not going to the school or that the school would not be prejudiced by admitting the extra child.

ClaraJo - I know what you mean. For what it is worth, the government lays down the formula that is used to determine a school's capacity. The school and the LA have no say in that. The LA can set an admission number that would take the school over capacity, but that is unusual. Appeal panels can admit children even when the school is over capacity, although they won't want to run into safety concerns.

The bit about admitting a child who has been excluded from another school is also set down by the government. When a child is excluded for the first time, the parent still has a right to express a preference. The school is generally not allowed to refuse to admit the child on the basis of their poor behaviour at another school.

Having become very familiar with the regulations for my appeal a couple of years ago, I can see the reasoning behind them. I also know they can be very frustrating when you come out on the wrong side.

Do try going on the waiting list and post national offer day your friend is free to put your DD's name down for any school's waiting list - even one she did not name on the CAF. Even if your mate's DD starts at the school in September she sld stay on waiting list of schools yshe likes, she can always move later on.And is your mate's DD bright or sporty- poorly performing schools love gifted and co-operative children, she will get noticed v quickly and will give her extra supportandn will be banded with the other brighter children. GOOD LUCK X

"At the appeal, the authority will argue that admitting your friend's daughter will cause prejudice to the school, e.g. because the school is already full." And ain't that the biggest crock of shit? "Sorry, we can't let your daughter in because she takes up too much space" and then, lo and behold, they find room for just one more "waffair thin" child. Either the school is full or it isn't. They chucked all these figures at me (cubic measurements of rooms/corridors etc.) and I felt like saying "so if you have a year group full of tall, fat kids, you end up with fewer places available in that year do you?" Ok, I'm being facetious, but they don't even seem to be able to stick to their own rules.

And DD2 comes home (from her state school) and says "Oh we've got a new kid in our class - got expelled from XYZ". Great. I love that kind of prejudice: "We won't let in your straight-A daughter who would be no trouble and be an asset to the school because that would prejudice the needs of the children who need to be able to cope with the turmoil caused by the next scissor-thrower to walk through those doors."

AAAARRRRRGGGGHHHHH

ItWouldBeMyPleasure - interesting. I don't know the situation in B&H in detail, but I've taken a look at their admission criteria. Being out of catchment does reduce your chances of getting admitted and doesn't help at appeal, although it shouldn't be fatal on its own. I note that B&H use random allocation rather than distance as the tie break. That is valid and makes it harder to show that they've made a mistake.

If B&H are leaning on their appeal panels to only allow appeals if they've made a mistake, someone should refer a case to the Local Government Ombudsman. The LGO will get detailed notes of the discussion that led to the decision. If they find the panel only considered whether or not a mistake was made they would not be too happy as that would be a clear breach of the statutory code.

Sue41 - Look through all the advice on this thread and the "Appeals" thread, particularly from Cory, Admission and myself. You always have a chance on appeal. Without knowing more details it is impossible to know how strong a chance you have.

Hi All

Similar space, my daughter has not been offered any of the 4 schools I put down, despite me only putting the 2 closest (except for the Roman Catholic school which was a sure no!) and two girls only schools.

Allocated to a school 1.5 miles away, not so far, but I don't drive and it is in an awkward spot to reach!! I couldn't take her and get to work on time....

Its a technology college and she is useless at maths and science.

Our first choice was only 0.829 miles away,
on all the waiting lists, now deciding on how to appeal.

Any help welcome and if we have any chance at all!! Our reasons are suitability of school and travel and the fact we are both working and our neighbours child goes and will look after her (at least initially, until she is settled and can make the journey there and back on her own). Is this enough?

Just trying to contact ACE -
www.ace-ed.org.uk
Which I found on an old posting, will buy the book from Amazon too....

Any tips, welcome

Prh...etc!. Thanks for that. I accept that appeals at secondary are more likely to be successful than at primary. However, B&H came under such flak when they changed their admissions policy last year, and are very anxious that 3 of their secomdaries are on the Govt target list for 'failing' schools that they are doing all they can to 'prove' the policy change was a success (and improve their failing schools by bussing in children from more middle class parts of the city).

I can't find the figures from last year, but many people had appeals rejected despite being in sight of their preferred school because they wre now 'out of catchment' (which is what I suspect is the case with the OP's friend). If that is the case, I hold out little hope for them at appeal.

One of the two schools I think the OP's friend didn't get was expanded last year to cope with the catchment change, and have always run at max capacity as the other schools are so rubbish.Also, the OP does not mention any special reasons why her friend's child might get in on appeal; some previous experience of bullying will not be sufficient grounds.

I do accept what you are saying, but knowing the situation on the ground, if there is no more info that the OP has presented, I would be very surprised if there was a happy outcome for the OP in B&H. At the moment it seems a case of - allocated school is two bus rides away, child will know no others going and the school is sh*t. No grounds for appeal there imo .

Just for info - interesting article here including opinion from someone familiar with B&H's appeal system.

ItWouldBeMyPleasure - The rules for appeals are set by the government. The LA CANNOT set its own rules. For secondary school appeals, you do NOT have to show that the authority did not follow its admissions policy or made an admin cock-up. You have a reasonable chance of success even if they've done everything correctly. I think you are talking about primary school appeals under infant class size prejudice rules, where you do have to show that the authority has made a mistake.

Spidermama - There is a much better chance of winning an appeal at secondary school than at primary. At primary you are often only able to win if there has been a mistake by the LA. At secondary it is much easier to win.

At the appeal, the authority will argue that admitting your friend's daughter will cause prejudice to the school, e.g. because the school is already full. Your friend should find out the capacity of the school, when it was set, whether there have been any building works such as new classrooms since it was set and so on - look at the "Appeals" thread for the advice from Cory, Admission and myself as it all applies here. If your friend can satisfy the appeal panel that admitting her daughter won't cause prejudice to the school, she will win the appeal.

Even if she can't do that, she still has a chance. She will need to show that the prejudice to her daughter from being forced to go to the allocated school is greater than the prejudice to the school from admitting her. For that, she must concentrate on any needs her daughter has (social or educational) that can only be met by the preferred school. She MUST NOT mention that the allocated school is failing or compare its academic record to her preferred school - that doesn't help her case and can turn the panel against her.

Good luck.

Spidermama. Sorry to hear your friend has had bad news. Do they live just outside the DS/V catchment? If there are inside then there might be an argument in appeal as furrycat says as when B&H changed the admissions policy they said they would make adequate provision for places for people in catchment.

If they live outside catchment, then I'm afraid it is unlikely they will have grounds for appeal. In B&H to appeal successfully, you have to shown that the authority did not follow its admissions policy. If they did, you have no grounds even if the school they have allocated is miles away/rubbish etc.

I assume they have been allocated PCC by your description, or possibly F? If I got either of those two I would be crying too. However, just because the situation seems wrong for many reasons, it doesn't mean they have grounds for appeal.

The other problem is that while your friend may be on the waiting list, I understand it is decided by the same criteria as the original admissions policy so they will always be passed over if there is a looked after child (for eg) or someone new to the area who lives closer who applies for a place.

It is truly rubbish. There is such a difference in quality between schools in B&H.

Unless your friend can prove an admin cock-up (which is v rare, but might include home-school distance being measured incorretly), then she is unlikely to be successful in appeal, no matter what pressure group she joins or what book she buys.

She might get lucky and get a place via the waiting list, but depending on where they are, that is unlikely.

Most likely chance of getting a place might be moving closer to the schools, but obviously there is a time delay on that, aside from all the obvious other issues that raises.

Not sure what you can do tbh. It isn't one of those situations that is likely to 'all come right in the end'. Your friend may have to accept her child is going to a shite school, or look elsewhere - Lewes?, or move .

We were well aware of this and so made our decision about where to live based on secondary catchments before our children were even at school. Seems crazy, but in B&H you have to play the system

Good luck and let us know how it goes.

clarajo
i really do feel for you
and yes i'm expecting it to be far worse than the whole divorce process ever was
OP how is your friend feeling now?
has she actually lodged the grounds for her appeal yet?

good luck to your friend, spidermama. I hope whatever the outcome is, that things are ok.
Have to say, although it still all smarts, ds has settled very well in his unchosen school

aseriouslyblondemoment I'm afraid there isn't an encouraging end to my tale of woe - I've ended up spending all my divorce settlement in the private sector to keep DD out of a school I didn't want her to attend. (The school itself has some really good points, but I've seen what it churns out )

I found the appeals panellists utterly two-faced. They made the right noises, sounded really encouraging and then slammed the door in our faces. And to make matters worse, the bloody letter the LEA sends you... tells you absolutely nothing about why your appeal was rejected, only why the council won (no space, blahdiblahdiblah).

In terms of trauma, I think I survived my divorce better...