Triple Science or Double Science. Am Confused!

Do the students have to back up opinion with facts, evidence, theory?

Surely the students by GCSE are fed up with all this healty eating stuff which they will have had since reception class. I am amazed not that everyone get A* but that anyone does in what sounds like tedious propaganda dress up as biology.

I wouldn't say that Additional Science was any different in the difficulty or authenticity of concepts.

While topics may look like harder concepts by their titles, they probably have more 'How Science Works' to balance out anything that is hard.

Ah, sorry, will try to put that link in properly:

www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/gcse-science-dumbed-down-says-exam-watchdog-1655 350.html

Webwiz - I found my bright students had exactly the same problem with Core Science (AQA) - they were over thinking the questions.

Additional Science has a bit more Science in it, so they weren't tripping up over all the opinion stuff and trying to second guess the examiner.

Core Biology at AQA was more like a PSHE lesson - eat a healthy diet, don't take drugs, don't damage the environment....

All the human biology stuff is in Additional, the heart doesn't turn up until Triple and the eye isn't in there at all any more.

Hence reports like this one:

www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/gcse-science-dumbed-down-says-exa m-watchdog-1655350.html

I thought grammar schools were supposed to be about providing high qualith education. What on earth would they stop a vhild studying one of the sciences merely because of a predicted grade. that's not education that's massaging the league table position - if the poor child has jumped through all the hoops to get in why should,kt they study what they want be interested in???

There probably is another piece of coursework (written up experiment, internal assessment or whatever description is flavour of the month - I think its all controlled assessment in school rather than coursework now) to make the double into the triple. I never did get the hang of the coursework element - you could use a bit of the science GCSE work for the additional science.

AQA is easier to understand, but comes to the same thing in the end but with fewer modules (I think).

'Science' comprises 3 papers (biology 1, Chemistry 1 and Physics 1) and an ISA (Internal Assesment) which can be in any of the three subjects. Our school does one ISA in each subject and uses the best. Usually all exams and ISAs done in year 10.

'Additional Science' 3 more papers (biology 2, chemistry 2 and physics 2) and another (slightly harder) ISA, again in any subject. Our school again does one of these ISAs in each subject and uses the best. Usually done in year 11.

'Biology/Physics/Chemistry' All need the relevent papers 1 and 2 (as above) an ISA in that subject and a paper 3 in that subject. In our school the people doing separate sciences sit the paper 2s in Jan year 11 and the paper 3s in June (whereas the 'Additional Scientists' just sit the paper 2s in June). No extra ISAs are needed for the separate scientists - they have already taken 2 in each subject and the best of these is chosen.

(I only know about OCR!)The Science GCSE is usually taken in year 10 with 9 modules (3 per science) and some coursework and a paper based on pre released material. Then additional science is taken in year 11 with an additional 9 modules, coursework etc. To make them into individual sciences you just need to add one more module of each science. The level of content in all the exams is equivalent whether doing one science, additional science or triple its just the extra work of fitting it all in means the triple is only offered to top sets or is instead of an additional option choice.

oh I see - so it is to do with the timings of the two papers. [dim]
so is the content really that different to the individual sciences? I had (naively) assumed that it was at a slightly lower level of difficulty but basically the same sort of stuff.

yes Muddleduck - they've got the hang of the stupid style of question by the time they take the additional science

webwiz
does that explain the students who are doing better in the "additional science" bit compared with the "science" bit?

Mine are both doing triple science and exams certainly aren't longer - they are spread out in a modular basis and mostly seem to be 40 mins! So if you don't do as well as predicted you have the chance to retake.

DS's school is a good state comp and around a third of the pupils take triple science.

Most of the rest take double, with the really non-academic ones taking single science.

I am very much in favour of keeping post 16 options open at 14 too actually and think that in that respect the GCSE science structure is quite good.

RatherBeOnThePiste, you might be surprised to know that there is actually nothing stopping you doing just one science at GCSE in the way the exams are structured. Just sit the papers at each level for that subject. But I think the NC strongly encourage (maybe even mandates?) that children do a mix of sciences so it is very rarely a choice offered in schools these days. I do know one girl who is doing just GCSE Chemistry & not Biology or Physics, but she is at an independent school & I've not heard of it in the state sector.

Oh and I think everyone in DD1's Biology A level class went onto study science at university - why? because they had a fabulous teacher who was inspiring (and bonkers!)

Well I meant it increases the uptake compared what it would have been if pupils had to choose at 14 not compared to past levels . Certainly science A levels are popular at DD2's sixth form.

"I'm sure it has increased the uptake of science A levels"

You'd be wrong there. Numbers taking Physics A level have dropped by 40% in the last 20 years & Chemistry numbers are down too. Quite a few University science departments have had to close due to falling numbers too.

Not entirely sure why, but the A levels are percieved as hard compared to other subjects & that puts some off. I also suspect the garbage in GCSE science puts a fair few off as well.

I think its a good thing that children are offered the chance to continue science to 16 without making a choice to specialise - I'm sure it has increased the uptake of science A levels.

But with regards to muddleduck's point, I don't think it is solely down to teaching if pupils aren't getting high grades. DD1 took the old edexcel double science which involved straight forward questions on each topic and a exam in the summer of year 11 covering the whole syllabus. She got two A*s and went on to take Biology A level and is in her first year of a Biology degree. DD2 took the Science and Additional Science GCSEs which as far as I could see was an exercise in "understanding what on earth the question is looking for". Instead of asking kids about vaccinations and immunity they would be given a conversation between various friends (all with various politically correct names) vaguely related to the science topic and they have to decide who is stating the correct information. DD2 would try and make the question harder than it actually was and would proceed to get the wrong answer despite being fully capable of understanding the science. I think she also felt less prepared for moving on to Science A levels than her sister did.

Of course in the ever changing world of education DS will do something different from his sisters. He will take triple science without any choice in the matter.

Watch out for how "double science" is taught. We're seeing lots of UCAS forms with a fantastic mark in "additional science" and a more mediocre mark in "science" which implies to me that some very bright kids are not getting a great deal when it comes to "science".

Double science ceased to be a few years ago.

Nowadays, they do "Science" in Year 10, and "Additional Science" in Year 11.

Depending on how the school organises their classes, they can also do 'Extension Units' spread over Year 10 and Year 11. If they do the extension units, they can be awarded Physics, Chemistry and Biology GCSEs, instead of Science and Additional Science.

I teach Edexcel 360 Science and here is how it works (I think it is similar for AQA). For both Science and Additional Science, the course is split into 10 modules of 10% each. There are separate examinations in Biology, Chemistry and Physics, where they do 2 modules each. In addition, they do a teacher marked assessment in Biology, Chemistry and Physics, and finally, a teacher assessement of their practical skills.

If they do extension units, there are two further units in each strand.

Whether to do Sci/Add Sci, or Bio/Chem/Phys depends on a lot of factors. Do they want to take Science A-levels? Although it is possible from Add Sci, it is easier from separate and they are much readier for January AS modules.

What about the other subjects they want to do? Do they want to do 2 MFLs, three humanities, arts, technology etc. These all need to be factored in. It can work both way for clever kids - they tend to be clever across the board. The less clever ones may have trouble filling their timetable if they, say, drop MFLs - they can still access the Sciences.

Triple Science is a lot of Science lessons in a week. They need to be broad and balanced at this stage in their education.

What are they likely to get? It is much better to get two A* than 3 As in the Sciences (and ditto for lower grades).

Does the school have all the clever kids doing Triple? If so, then it might be a good idea to follow them to avoid disruptive pupils or a focus on foundation level work.

On balance, I would say yes, if wanting to continue to A-level, and yes, if it means avoiding disruptive kids. Anything else, I would say tread carefully.

Both my children have done AQA core and additional science ( "double science" using the vocab above) but I don't believe it has been called this since 2007 as violet queen mentioned it is now known as science (core science) and additional science. They are both separate GCSEs, so you can get different grades. Some schools take GCSE core science in year 10 and then additional science in year 11. Hope this is helpful?