come and convince me that bright but quiet children don't get lost in large comprehensives

TheFallenMadonna Tue 06-Oct-09 22:21:25 Add a message | Report post | Contact poster

"Ah. Homework should be chased up for sure. I check my form's homework diaries, but I don't think they're any substitute for subject teachers chasing it up. Or indeed for students actually doing their homework..."

That last sentence is not unimportant. Unless the child has SEN or some kind of emotional problem, it is not unreasonable to expect him or her to be responsible for organising homework by the age of 11, let alone 15. They are no longer babies, they ought to be able to understand that they are in charge of their future.

Not saying schools shouldn't do their bit, but just being quiet is no excuse for not getting the work done.

Ah. Homework should be chased up for sure. I check my form's homework diaries, but I don't think they're any substitute for subject teachers chasing it up. Or indeed for students actually doing their homework...

Oh, silly things like making sure she did her homework. I can check that she's doing what is written in the planner but
if she doesn't write it in, then I can't check
if the school doesn't check the planner, then she won't write in
if she twigs that there are no repercussions for missed or shoddy homework then she will slide (human nature, innit)

DS was very quiet when he started his secondary partly due to friend/bullying issues, but thankfully he likes talking to adult so he has really thrived.

They were set from yr7 in Maths, english and then another set for all the other subjects. He is one of the high fliers in his year but still got a nagging at parents evening last year from his science teacher because he felt he could do even better.

This is a mixed ability comp in Herts, but not in the expensive parts of Herts.

She was underachieving across the board? It's difficult to comment of course without knowing the situation. I teach children who are currently underachieving (grrr for my residuals...). I can usually pinpoint why. Sometimes I can do something about it, sometimes it has to come from them. What extra input did you want?

As an experiment, I stopped signing off her homework planner to see what reaction that would get. I was still waiting for someone to notice, never mind react, by the end of the year.

I knew that she was underachieving and went to see the school about it. Their attitude was that she wasn't the Number One Best Pupil in School and therefore was nothing special and didn't merit extra attention. I was very firmly put back in my place.
They looked at the result (above average, so that will do) not the comparison to target.

When you say extra input - do you mean over and above normal teaching? Or do you think the teaching itself was substandard? Did oyu know she was underachieving? Was that picked up on by her teachers?

pointyhat: of course I asked for extra input!

If she had been Oxbridge material, she might have got it (merely conjecture: can't remember the last time the school had an Oxbridge candidate). If she was struggling, she would have definitely got it. But she was in that middle-ground that gets little attention.

I was bright and quiet in a comprehensive school with a 7 form entry.

I achieved highly academically.

Well, I've just had my performance management review and I can assure that is exactly what happened. If I get a negative residual I am in trouble. Every grade counts. So if I have a pupil predicted an A and they get a B, that is negative, despite being above a C. Schools are judged onthe A-C. I* am judged on my residuals!

Sunshine - believe me, we did NO extra stuff with our DD apart from take an interest, read through her homework if she asked etc. She went waaay beyond what we ever achieved anyway.

The school, whilst huge, was a good school with very motivated staff who have a lot to contend with trying to get the results that they somehow manage.

My ds is in a huuuge south London comprehensive, in Y8. He's bright- but ve-e-e-ry shy.

We have found that the teachers have bent over backwards not only to accommodate him- and the likes of him- but to push him to do stuff he wouldn't've considered doing in his primary school.

I reckon you can spot a school like this within about 10 minutes of first visiting it. Honest.

Did you feel extra input was needed, iam? Had you requested some?

What a load of crappola.
Teachers love to trot out stuff like "our performance as teachers is judged against the performance of every one of our pupils against their target grades". But at other times they will tell you that there is only so much individual attention they can give kids when there are 29 others in the class!
DD entered the school being predicted 'straight As' at GCSE. She therefore got no extra input as she was a cert to get them the magic '5 GCSE at C or above'. She got the magic 5 but not the string of A.

Mussyhillmum: No - nothing was set for the first term, then Maths & English (maybe another - long time ago!), but they were put into general "sets" in Yr 8 (only top 2 sets did a second language) and then set within those by subject.

TBH- DD was a LOT happier when things were set and she could loose the undesirables! She then just had to contend with the bright boys who just liked to clown around in her sets

Still - she survived, and is now clowning herself (probably) at Freshers week!

Does your school set straight away for maths and English? Check. Do they set for science and when? Check.

It doesn't take teachers long to work out the personality and ability of every child they teach. DON't worry about that.

If your child ends up in a class full of real bammers who disrupt certain classes, get in touch with the school. Talk through options. Most teachers should still be able to teach well enough, and your child will still be able to learn. Don;t hesitate to complain if that isn't happening.

Quite apart from any other issues, and I am certainly more than merely "grateful for quiet pupils who just get on with things", our performance as teachers is judged against the performance of every one of our pupils against their target grades. We need to put as much effort into the quiet and bright ones as we do the challenging or less able ones.

And regarding getting to know them - in large school there are more teachers. It doesn't mean we spend less time with each individual pupil that we teach, it means that in one year we teach a smaller proportion of the pupil body.

dd1 is bright and not exactly quiet but not a huge extrovert either. So far (1 month in ) I've been very happy with her school. She's getting lots of encouragement and recognition of her hard work. I'm not sure about the streaming but I suspect they have been because she was doing some maths homework today that involved some serious logic!

ds(16) didn't - on line to get a few As!

i worry about my other son when he goes there though!

Milliways - did your DD's school set for subjects? Our nearest secondary school is a large comprehensive with a VERY mixed intake. It sets in very few subjects, maths from year 7 and science from year 9. There is no setting at all in English. DH and I went along to the open evening, but the HM failed to explain how mixed ability teaching stretches the more able - merely mocked the poor woman who asked the question! Like the OP I fear my bright DS will "drift". Please give me hope!

Not London, we are in Reading - which has it's own issues

I think in her actual form, the split was about 50/50 - maybe weighted more towards the less desirable elements, but they had a 10 form intake, so across the year there were plenty of others to meet, and she soon got a crowd of really good friends (that she will now miss terribly as they go to different Uni's , jobs etc).

She didn't go to grammer, I send her to the very rough local high school.