Now I know why I always regretted that DS~1 was not a joiner and a do-er.

I agree with that sentiment - one person's opportunity is another person's hell. But you do have to actually appraise the opportunities available and give some of them a go to at least have a chance of finding your niche.

But of course Anna...

I think you have to find your niche. I don't think it is automatically a 'shame' if someone doesn't take opportunities available to them, however marvellous they might seem to someone else.

TheFallenMadonna - I do believe that there is a bit of a mismatch between the skills and personalities that universities recruit on, and the skills and personalities that the world of work (and life in general) recruit on!

I say that as someone who got a First (with distinction!) in her undergraduate degree, and didn't find it very appropriate in the big wide world! My family and university tutors thought I was the bees knees, of course...

My DS1 (just turned 9) is like this and I think it is part laziness, I'm slightly ashamed to say. He sometimes goes to things and says he has a nice time but then says he doesn't want to do them again. He basically can't be bothered. I suppose he hasn't found his club - I don't think there are many clubs about for history fanatics though!! It is a shame he won't broaden his horizons though.

I suppose I was a little bit the same but my excuse is that I am quite shy and joining things is quite difficult. DS isn't shy (although DS2 is a also doesn't seem to want to join in things but he is only 5 so time yet).

It is a shame as there are so many more opportunities now than when I was a child.

I think you're being a little over-wrought about this, orm.Ha has one big hobby - skateboarding - is that right? Well, that's not bad. It's active, skilful, sociable. You're letting him know what's out there, other opportunties are offered.

We would all like our children to be extrovert, talented and sociable, to have clear aspiration and determination. To some extent, this depends on personality and so your worry and cajoling (if that's what you do)could be taken very personally.

Correlation or cause though Anna?

I too regret all the things I tried and gave up, or was too shy to try, as a child and have always been anxious to make sure my DC don't head the same way.

It would appear that I have a 'joiner' in DS, though - I was astonished to hear from other parents that they had been talking/forcing their DC into continuing with various after school activities. I had tried quite hard to talk DS into giving up at least one (none of them are expensive in themselves, but they add up) to no avail.

Orm, I would echo someone else's comment about not despairing - I changed my 'not joining' ways in the 6th form and at Uni. That said, if we had had robotics club I would have been in there like a shot .

"But it seems to me.... that people who join in with others and try out lots of activities generally end up better adjusted and more successful in both their work and personal lives."

I agree.

I'm a big believer in making them do things. DS2 has acute lazyitis. I make him go to piano lessons. I make him play every day for 20 mins, if he doesn't the Playstation is banned at the weekend. I make him go out for a walk to get some fresh air. It's a pain and I'd rather not insist to be honest.

"We are on the look out for the ones who are going to come to university and spend all their time in the library!"

I know this is true. My family is chock-a-block full of these types - bookish sorts who got firsts and PhDs.

But it seems to me (with hindsight, and a distinctly unbookish DP) that people who join in with others and try out lots of activities generally end up better adjusted and more successful in both their work and personal lives.

LOL at msled.

OrmIrian, I think sometimes there is too much stress on extra-curricular stuff, and schools can make really exacerbate this.

I am an academic, and we find that students tend to stuff their personal statements full of extra-curricular stuff that, to be brutally honest, we are not really interested in. We are on the look out for the ones who are going to come to university and spend all their time in the library!

But the schools seem to really push all the sport/music/Duke of Edinburgh stuff, which is great if the kids are into it but is certainly NOT a prerequisite for getting into university.

Perhaps your DS will be more the dreamy academic sort with his nose in a book/physics computer game? That can turn out well too!

Does it matter if they aren't a joiner? At least you know that in a different life they wouldn't be signing up to, say, the Hitler Youth and eagerly ironing thei own black shirt before meetings?
I was listening to lovely David Mitchell (comedian) on Desert Island Discs. he was no joiner and he's doing fine.

Orm, you could be writing about MY DSs esp no 1! It frustrates the hell out of me that he in particular can see no value in anything particularly extracurricular! I will be frank and say we (DH and I) have practically FORCED both DSs into Scouting because we think it's so good for them. Admittedly we HAVE had some success with our persistence (which involved us getting VERY involved!)

I have a good friend who is perfectly relaxed about the fact her DD can't be arsed, she REALLY has to WANT to do something, and chooses nothing!- but I recall when I was a kid I had to BEG to be allowed to do violin lessons, guitar, speech and drama whereas here I am 'begging' my boys to get involved! I think Scouts is good in that it involves non-school friends, has a social conscience and IS FUN (even the boys concede they've had a good time when they get home!); piano and recorder because I believe that the ability to read and play music is a life skill up there with bike riding AND I believe it develops a part of their brains as does sport (DS1 does do karate with minimal fuss which is as close as we get to 'enthusiasm'!).

Another friend has 'solved' the problem by an expensive Prep. where doing an (extracurricular) musical instrument is compulsory, as are most of the 'clubs' etc! She has said to me in as many words that she's paying for not feeling any guilt because she is not only laying all these opportunities out in front of her DSs, there's a fair element of compulsion in doing them!! It would SERIOUSLY pee me off if I sent my DSs to Opportunity Central at great expense but they couldn't be bothered to avail themselves of the facilities and clubs!

FWIW both DSs did get '1's for effort in all their school work so they're apparently not idle there!

OrmIrian if your DS has a good attitude to schoolwork and has tried out a few clubs in year 7 that he didn't get on with then I wouldn't despair yet - he isn't actively ducking out of things its just that he hasn't found something to spark his enthusiasm. DS has been most involved with things in the music department because the music teachers hunt you down in the corridor and drag you off to rehearsals if you show the slightest interest The PE department are the same (DD2 hid in the toilets once to avoid being made to take part in something sporty out of school). So the teachers realise that kids might be a bit reluctant to get involved in things at first especially in year 7 and so make an effort to engage them.

Interesting , could easily be ds, 11 and just going into year 7. He is useless at taking in information and acting upon it without prompting. Has no concept of having to seize the moment, over thinks what he might like to do then regrets it when too late.

Maybe he gets it from me ....

Interesting thread.

At the moment the dcs are pottering around the house, busy doing nothing. Everyone else is off doing sporty camps, music masterclasses etc etc.

Whenever I suggest some sort of hobby to ds, he groans deeply.

But... do I belong to anything? Er, no. I keep saying to ds, "Learn from my mistakes", but he really seems to have inherited the lone wolf gene.

Am so pleased to have found this thread. We have just met up with friends whose children are swimming for county, singing for the country, etc etc and my two are just not interested. We give them opportunities but DS just can't be arsed TBH.

you are probably right about the bell curve thing webwiz, I just wondered if there was some family dynamic effect coming to play where children in the same family actively tried to be as different from each other as possible.

Hi snorkle - I would have thought its a bell curve thing with most kids in the middle happily doing a few things they enjoy and a smaller number at the two extremes. DH was motivated to do well at school etc and works hard but has done nothing other than play a bit of football (and a lot of watching it) he doesn't really get the value of taking part in things or the need to pay for expensive lessons on musical instruments for the DCs. I am a self confessed doer and feel there is something missing if I'm not at some sort of committee or starting something new.

I think perhaps DD1 would have done more if she'd had a bit more self esteem and wasn't scared of trying new things which is a bit different from not "needing" to do anything. Perhaps its our job as parents to help our kids find the right balance for them personally.

webwiz - sounds horribly like your dd may be heading for journalism. Or another career with lots of pressing deadlines.

I am a journalist and would say the vast majority of us seem to have been drawn to this career partly because you HAVE to meet immediate deadlines. Give a journalist a lengthy deadline and they will procrastinate until the very last minute.

Point is, people whose brains are wired to need immediate external pressure before they can get off their behinds do fall into careers that fit. (And I'm sure there are other careers with similar pressures, it's just I don't know about them.)