IGCSE branded 'marketing tool'

Yes, but don't worry - its still okay/encouraged to advertise the Guradian on here.

There have been a few links to that website lately - perhaps it's being seen as advertising?

see for yourself -- would this be against the rules? seems a bit odd to delete

Interesting site, thanks!

Message withdrawn

But you know that with such a question, the A grade would have been for the essay that not only knew its stuff, but questioned, explored, investigated. The students would have known that too. The grading system was the key.

However -- if you knew your stuff, but history was not your talent, you could still do well through hard work. And you had a good grounding in the subject then. You'd had to write it all down a number of times, no reading, copying, pasting and editing, and you'd had to learn it.

It's too easy to say that there was nothing more than reproducing notes. That's not true at all.

I would be very interested to see questions that say "recite the plot".

Edam, I don't think these theories come from nowhere. There is no smoke without fire. Maybe more boys are bad at coursework, I don't know. But it hasn't just been made up. I think it's inextricably linked to this, and to the "traditional teaching" debate, as well as the private/public debate.

oh, please don't let's start another 'the education system discriminates against boys' debate running. Mostly because it ain't true but also because this idea that girls are shit at exams REALLY grates.

I thought iGCSE was a better prep for IB, which is supposed to be another reason for doing it as more and more schools move over.

UQD I don't remember any O level English questions along the lines of "recite the plot". Maybe that's just me. And what's wrong with a question about the causes of the First World War? I don't get what you're cross about there.

It may be that some children do worse at iGCSE because less coursework = less help from teachers in re-writing and less help from the internet in constructing one's work in the first place. I think it would be a bit naive to think this is not an element.

Aren't boys supposed to be "better" at exams and girls at coursework? There could be a balance to be redressed here, as girls are supposed to have had a system that "suits" them better for a decade or so -- which in turn was a redress of an earlier imbalance, possibly.

Why on earth would parents pay to have their child taught a history syllabus that doesn't cover their own country? Madness.

That's v interesting lazymum, if the private schools suddenly find they are not getting the strings of A/A*s any more there may be a mass exodus from the IGCSE.

Conversely, if the IGCSEs were used in state grammar schools and top stream comps then the students currently not being stretched at the moment would prob do very well.

Obviously there will still be pupils in the private schools who still get the top grades plus those in other schools that don't, but at the moment the GCSEs are at a standard that if you do the work, and are motivated, and aren't in a disrupted class, and are taught properly etc, (and get your parents to 'help' with coursework) it is quite easy to get As and A*s.

Upping the standard of GCSEs would actually make it a lot fairer all round.

It's a bit more complicated I think.

One independent school (ok Godolphin) does the IGCSE in history I was told by two separate history teachers there that their girls found them easier because 1) no British history and 2) no course work. "Our girls are good at taking exams" I was told.

Yes - with private you're paying for the choice of education - the iGCSE route is available if you choose that. But if your local state is vocational-oriented you just don't have that choice. It seems easier for the high-acheiving states to 'contract out' to the local college - and that system does work well - but if you're in a less high-acheiving school your GCSE options ivolve lots of D&T and subjects with 'studies' rather than say, additional languages etc.

Local schools operate 6th form consortiums, I'm not sure why they can't do similar at GCSE. Logistic nightmare I suppose.

What a racket.

IGCSEs have backfired on some private school pupils. I know a few who now have a string of B's in the results cos they did IGCSEs in 3 separate sciences and maths and these are not their strong subjects. A/A* are actually quite difficult to get in IGCSEs. They've got friends in other schools with all As cos they took the GCSEs. Not going to look good on their UCAS forms.

I think there are several tiers actually.

Two of the top private schools locally do iGCSE's. The other two don't yet - but may follow suit. All offer A levels or IB in 6th form

The less academic private schools stick to GCSE's with much the same topic coverage as state.

The good local state schools do GCSE's in largely traditional subjects, whilst shipping less academic students off to local college for courses in eg Health & Social care. All do tradit A levels and IB

Less good local state do far higher proportion of vocational courses - in fact, if you get a place there it's actually quite difficult to do a traditional set of GCSE's. This is to boost their apparent A-C success rate. They do A levels, Btecs and now going to offer the new diplomas.

Presumably because it's too hard for 'average' children and they won't be able to get a C grade in it, whereas they can in the normal GCSE.

The state sector has to take into account children with many varying different levels of intelligence and they do not have the resources to teach the IGCSE separately for those brighter children nor to spend time tutoring the 'average' children up to that level, which the private sector does.

DS1's old independent school says this of iGCSE (and this year's league tables for GCSEs):
Government statistics ... suggest that students at X School gained ?zero? in the league tables of GCSE examination performance. We are delighted to make it clear that 100% of our students gained 5A-C grades, including Maths and English. In fact, 87% of all their examinations were graded either A or A - an absolutely outstanding performance.

It is because X School is a pioneer in the use of IGCSEs that these achievements are not recognised in the government league tables.

IGCSEs are the international form of the qualification, which our students sit in Mathematics, Physics, Chemistry and Biology. We are convinced that IGCSEs in those subjects are more rigorous than the conventional GCSE course, and better preparation for A-level and beyond.

Universities know that the IGCSE qualification has full parity with standard GCSEs. It is a matter of regret that the government does not similarly recognise them in these tables.

However, we wear our 'zero' with pride. It is a sign that we are not driven by league table performance. Instead, we use our independence to design a curriculum which offers our students the most stimulating educational experience and the soundest preparation for future life.

(It's an academic school for academic children largely from academic/professional families that models itself on grammar schools rather than public schools)

My understanding is that the igce doesn't have course work whereas some gsces do. Since lots of people consider course work a 'soft option' and open to cheating then the exam based igce is considered more rigourous.
But I'm no expert on this.
Either way instead of bleating about unfairness the state should ask themselves why independent schools want to do it and why state schools don't offer them.

Well, I agree, bagsforlife. It's not optimal for anyone, is it?

They have only just brought in an A at A level this year. Oxford, I think, has already said it will be predominantly independent school pupils who achieve this and therefore will take it into account when making offers, (ie NOT to discriminate against state pupils) which will incense the private sector no doubt. However, I am willing to bet that many of the pupils at my DCs state grammar school will get the A grade though.

By the way, those able ones who are getting A grade GCSE levels in their work at 12 or whatever, sometimes get bored by the time they doing the actual GCSEs (along with very teenagery and distracted) and don't always get the As when they actually take the exams (I know from experience with my DS1 I am afraid...)