I've just had a phone call from the mum of one of dd's friends saying that dd is bullying her daughter.

Christ Seeker that other mother has been completely inappropriate.

I just read through the thread - didn;t see it at the time. I thought you dealt with everything extremely well. I also rememebr a thread ages back when your dd just started senior school, it was about a load of friendship problems. Both you and your dd came across as very empathetic and dealt with the issues really well.

Second some posts above that you call the girl's mother and say you have spoken to other mothers on the bus and all concur with your dd. I would be livid if a mother accused my 13 year old dd of something like that, how dare she go and confront a teenager as if she is a fully grown woman. What 13 year old wouldn't be upset by that? It sounds as if this woman has got it everything completely out of proportion.

Afraid I disagree, southern, this woman has already been abusive in public. And I don't think it would be good for seeker's dd to be exposed to another attack, as seems likely.

Seeker - think in your shoes I'd contact the other girl's school and the bus company. Wouldn't have suggested the school originally, but given the mother's behaviour I think it's now the right thing to do. Just explain what happened this morning, point out the mother is now wading in, and the drivers should be aware.

And tell the other woman what she did was outrageous! Your dd has tried to be polite but you have seen her daughter blank your dd herself. It is appalling that a grown woman is trying to bully your dd.

One thought - can you arrange for you and your daughter to meet the other mum and her daughter at a neutral venue (coffee shop etc)? People are generally much less willing to be rude and confrontational face to face rather than over the phone. Agree with all the advice about staying calm - I would ask her what her solution is, and make sorting this out her problem not yours, with the focus on how her dd can change her bevaiour, not just your dd having to change hers). This may also give your dd a chance to say she is already doing those things, or why the suggestions are not practical if that is the case.

Gosh, Seeker. Sorry this is still dragging on for you and your DD. I think whatever you say to the other mother won't ultimately make any difference. This is absolutely about her and her insecurities, and she is using your daughter as the peg to hang them all on I'm afraid. I think you have to remember that when you speak to her.

I would refer the mother back to the conversation you had earlier this year. You can say your DD has tried to make an effort but she feels it is not reciprocated. Say your DD is confused by this, but perhaps it would be better if the girls just gave each other a wide berth. You are sorry her DD will have to sit on the bus away from your DD, but it is only a bus ride and she will have a better day when she gets to school and joins up with all her real friends. (And I suspect this is part of the problem. Does she have any friends at her school? If not that is not your DD's problem anyway).

I would let her know her actions this morning were threatening and inappropriate and you are sure she realizes it did nothing to help the situation. Don't go in all guns blazing though - you don't want to give her anything to kick back at. Keep it calm and civil (I am sure you will!)

Her DD sounds quite needy and insecure. Her mother is validating her insecurity by fighting her imaginary battles for her. (Don't tell her that btw!)

You need to tell your DD that this is absolutely not about her and that the other mother was wrong to do what she did. She should be polite and pleasant to this girl, but ultimately keep her distance.

(And then when the phone call is over you can pour yourself a large glass of something nice and start sticking pins in that vodoo doll!)

I had a 'friend' at secondary school who was like this - any perceived slight was reported to her mother, who would then ring round our mothers and complain that we were bullying her. Luckily her mother never resorted to shouting directly at us - just wouldn't let us in the house when 'friend' occasionally invited us over. 'Friend' is now apparently married and no longer in contact with anyone from school, after being asked to be a bridesmaid for a mutual pal and then pulling out at the last minute (due to another perceived slight).

My mother punished me a couple of times for apparently bullying this girl, then realised what the situation was, and advised me to be civil, but not much more - it kind of worked, but there is still a lot of ill feeling in the old group I hung around in towards this girl. Sadly, there are loonies everywhere.

(Oh, and we're all 27/28 years old now, you'd think we'd have forgotten about it by now!)

what a cow (the other mother). No doubt the daughter learnt her social skills at that woman's knee...

Oh how awful for your DD.She seems to have been trying really hard to include this girl but it seems to me that this girl is jealous of your dd's popularity and is trying to make trouble for her. It seems strange that the mother approached you first last time but has gone straight to your dd this time.

I too would tell the mum that you have spoken to other mums and that the problem lies with her dd not yours.

Is it possible for you to have a word with the bus driver and see if he has noticed any problems on the bus?

Ah, tricky.

The other mother needs a reality check. Firstly, it's really Not Okay to challenge somebody else's child over something that they may or may not have done to your child -- apart from anything else, and however badly you think the child has behaved it puts her as the adult in the position of being accused of bullying. So I think you should make it very clear to her that you are extremely unhappy that she has approached your dd in those terms.

Secondly, if they're secondary age then they should be old enough to sort most things out between themselves, assuming that there's no suggestion of actual bullying or threatening. There's not v. much kudos in having your mum come and fight your battles for you. If dd was in this other girl's position I'd be trying to talk her through ways that she could behave in order to help make the situation easier, but remind her that in the end you can't force people to be friends with you if they don't want to and suggest that she take in a book or magazine to read on the bus to distract her. Whereas this mum seems to be blaming other dc for her own daughter's lack of social skills.

When you speak to the mother I would make sure you tell her about the 'blanking' etc, so that she knows you have seen it and it isn't just on your DDs word.

I'd also tell the mother that as a result of her verbally abusing your DD you spoke to some other mothers all of whom agreed that the problem is more with her DD than yours.

I would be FURIOUS that she had spoken to my DD in this way. Does your DD have to take the bus - could she avoid this girl for a while by travelling another way?

I would also be tempted to speak to the school - is the other girl like this at school - if she is it might help for the mother to hear this.

Very for your DD

It's so heartening that people take this kind of thing so seriously now. (Though I'm glad that your daughter has been vindicated, Seeker! She's obviously a lovely girl.)

My life was hell at school for some years because a group of girls decided to 'do' exclusion and tormenting on me. ?

Your poor dd. It isn't her fault that she is popular! It is good though that she is understanding of the other girl. I hope the other girl's mum appreciates that.

So, as suspected, the problem lies with the girl and not with your dd's "bullying". I still maintain this is one "hands-on" mother. Most girls surely would be mortified at their mother setting up a meeting to part-accuse and part-engineer a friendship.

Oh dear! She sounds like an unhappy little soul......I wondered about this too!

I hope mum remembered to thank both you and your daughter for being so reasonable and apologised to your daughter especially.

Whilst I think it is essential to teach our children to be kind, generous, fair etc etc they do not need to take on the role of the rescuer....that's a bit to much of a burden.

I was wondering about this today. Poor DD. Hope things are better after half term.

Like I said it depends on the circumstances and there may be an overreaction on the other girl's part or there may be a deliberate exclusion. The OP's dd may have tried to move on with friendships but this girl didn't take the hint. I agree if the girl has difficulty making other friends then it isn't the OP's dd's problem. If she has been sitting with OP's dd and dd has been ignoring her and encouraging others to do the same (that being key) then I'd be having words if it were my child.

Whatever the true reason I don't think this is an appropriate age to expect them to work it out for themselves without some help. I wouldn't think it was 'managing their friendships for them'. My brother was bullied so badly at school that the head threatened to permanently exclude the three boys responsible. It was my father who suggested giving them a second chance. It was entirely appropriate that he was involved and not left to my brother to try and resolve. I was also at school with someone who was bullied mercilessly by other boys. He killed himself at 16.

I'm not sure what this other mum hopes to achieve by, "insisting on us meeting, so we are going to get together on Tuesday afternoon to talk about it".

Is this really what parents do for their children these days, manage their friendships for them?

Applaud the OP's sensitivity and recognition that her dd may be at fault - though equally may not be.

Let's get this in proportion though. They attend different schools, so we're talking about a bus ride in the mornings. One bus ride, lasting how long? And the net result is "this other girl doesn't want to go to school and is in tears every night." Because that sounds like a massive over-reaction, given that your dd might at worst be not including this girl in conversations. Is there something more in the other family's dynamics?

and i really feel for you btw, it is horrible that this could be happening or that your dd is accused of it wrongly.

for me, the fact that your daughter and her friend immediately recognised that something was going on would ring alarm bells....not saying that your dd is doing what she is accused of, but think that if both of them immediately piped up that she is always saying she is being left out, that could easily be a way of them denying (to themselves as much as anything) that they are being purposely hurtful...this is just the kind of response that a bully might make. think it definitely needs further exploration, on tuesday i guess, before conclusions of guilt or innocence or misunderstanding are drawn.

her not here

damn, my cunning plan has backfired.

(I knew here when she was just an ordinary mumsnetter, you know )