We didn’t get any of our choices - appeals & what next

Not that it counts for everything but have you read the ofsted report for the school that got RI? Was it in all areas? Have a read of it.

Also, like you I could only put down 3 schools when my dc were that age.

All the best.

We've only ever had 3.

Op - what is it RI for? What are the details of the report, what do others who go there say? Find people like you with children there. Find out about their experiences and opportunities.

As I said my dc went to a RI undersibscribed school. They are well behaved, bright, sporty, join in with everything. They've had a great time!

Yes they've seen assaults and police involvement and almost sorts of things I would rather they hadn't but they have lovely friends, great experiences and have or will get 7-9 grades.

RI doesn't have to be a disaster at all (and your dh will know that Ofsted isn't everything).

As several of us have noted, many LAs only offer three preference slots, I don’t know where the op is but we only have three where I live.

@Switchy111 isit your catchment school you have been offered?

Why didn’t you fill in spots 4 5 and 6 on the form?

So this goes back to the problem I talked of earlier. If your closest non-selective school was not put on your CAF, you may find that you are refused transport costs.

How bad is the knife problem? I think most schools will have had at least one or two incidents where a knife has been taken to school, but I appreciate that some schools have more persistent difficulties.

So the school you have been allocated is the catchment school?

Sorry it has felt like an interrogation but people can't really advise on the appeal without understanding the dynamics such as the banding,

Closest only matters if distance is used as a tie breaker. This school might be the closest, but because it uses banding, aptitude, etc., then it's impossible to tell how likely it is to get in and it isn't a 'safe' bet, which is the purpose of choosing your closest school. The theory goes that with non-selective mainstream schools, the closer you are to the school, the higher up the chain you'd be, so the more likely you are to get a place. All bets are off when it's a school that uses banding or lottery systems.

Yes valid points about the catchment school vs closest. In fact something like that is the case near me.

So @Switchy111 did you apply to your catchment school? If not can you go on the WL for it?

She says in a later post that it is her closest school but that she is out of catchment.

Which implies that she does have a different, catchment, school.

A catchment school not being the closest is reasonable common, as schools are rarely perfectly symmetrically placed within a community. Catchments (rather than simple distance) are in fact most often used in this type of ‘unusually distributed schools’ situation, to avoid having some people close to 2 schools with the probability of getting a place in either, while others are far from both and have no probability of a place in either.

The ‘choice’ rhetoric disguises the fact that this is in reality a way of trying to match supply and demand for school
places, where as many children as possible have a good chance of getting a place in 1 school, and the system knows which school is your preference should you (when the algorithms are run) have a chance of a place at more than one.

Im so confused what your husband and his parents housing has to do with it? All of your appeal arguments seem incredibly weak

Closest school doesn’t necessarily mean their catchment school depending on boundaries.

OP says their first pref is their closest school.

I agree it is odd if there is no priority for the closest school.

Op, my dc have gone to a RI secondary. It's been great, my dc have been on trips, done dofe, been in plays, concerts and loads of sports teams. They have lovely friends and are high achievers academically.

Go and look at the school and give it a chance with an open mind.

When you say "Labour" do you mean "school population forecasts that have been predicting this issue for may years now"?

I recognise the two terms are confusing.

Inner London was hit first. It's feeding through to secondaries in more urban outer London now and primaries in suburban parts - I'm a primary governor and this is the first year we haven't been oversubscribed for reception on first preferences, and all local primaries are seeing a similar decline. Som have closed classes already and reduced their PAN.

And that's part of the issue. Place scarcity can actually be exacerbated because the funding model and funding settlement combined mean that running anything but full classes is financially ruinous for most schools. Many schools are taking preemptive action and reducing their PANs (and offerings) so they aren't stuck with an unsustainable half-full class of kids and have to do complicated composite classes.

I know secondaries in Ealing and Hounslow who have both recently reduced their PANs by 30 despite being nominally oversubscribed - so competition gets more fierce, not less, as the population decline works its way through the system.

I think the GP's house is a bit of a red herring - it's a 'family/childcare' argument for the appeal but those don't have much weight.

If you’re not in the catchment of your closet school (choice 1) which school are you in catchment for? Why didn’t you apply for that?

What is the significance of the grandparents house? Does dad live there or is it just to go to after school?

This sounds so difficult. I hope it all works out somehow.

I agree with the pp who said you could go and visit the school he has been allocated. It may not be as bad as you think. Even while you're appealing it might be a good idea to look at the "worst" case scenario, which may actually be absolutely fine

OP - so did you apply to your catchment school, where you would have had priority?

I can see that with 3 slots on the form, it is really hard emotionally to take up a slot with a ‘banker’ school (a school that you are as certain as possible to get a place in, even if you don’t love it) rather than a ‘choice’ school) but it’s still critical to do so. I know your catchment school - or the banker you should have used - will now be full, but it would still be a school you would be placed high up the waiting list for through catchment priority. Definitely one to request to be added to the list for.

Are you sure about that? Because, for example, Northampton Schools say:

"Criteria 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 will be applied strictly in the order stated above. Children allocated places under these criteria are included in the bands. These children will be allocated places from the bands first and this will determine how many places in each band remain, before Criterion 7 is then finally applied. The total number admitted from each band will be equal."

In other words, if there are 5 sibling link places, then they might all come from band 1, so the number of places in band 1 for criterion 7 will be reduced by 5. In the same vein, someone who was admitted under staff connection, would reduce the number of places in their respective band.

So the total number of places allocated to each band is 'fair' regardless of how it's made up.

Because Scotland has c.5m people and England has c57m people. If we all moved to Scotland, then you'd have a similar shitshow on your hands in no time.

"Other than that places are allocated via a fair banding system and you think if he had scored differently there would have been fewer students in his band, giving him a better chance of a place? I am no expert on this but tbh it seems less than fair if the bands are set and then oh look! More students fall into the middle band so they have less chance of a place? Surely the bands are reset (as needed) to give a similar number in each one? So it (eg) there are 200 spaces and 600 took the test and applied, and there are four ability bands so 50 are taken from each band, you would hope that the bands would each have about 150 pupils, rather than the top band having 80 and the second band 200? Otherwise it’s hardly a fair banding test surely? The whole point of those tests as I understand it is not to be selective, but to ensure an even spread of ability?"

@clary It depends on the school. Some schools, such as Trinity Cathedral Academy say " The marks are divided into four bands and we are instructed how many children to take from each band e.g. if 40% of those applying are identified in band 2, then 40% of our intake has to be from this band. This ensures that the places offered reflect the ability range of our applicants."

Other schools, such as City of London Academy say "Approximately the same number of children will be admitted in each of the four bands so that each band represents 25% of the applicants."

So some schools adjust the boundaries to ensure that 25% of applicants are in each band, whilst others set a pre-determined threshold for each band, but then admit a proportional number of applicants from each band.

However, there are concerns that fair banding tests are not fair. https://comprehensivefuture.org.uk/how-fair-is-fair-banding/ "“If schools run poorly advertised tests on a Saturday, with offputting application forms, and then select bands from within the mostly middle class children sitting the test, it’s no surprise they end up with a skewed intake that is less diverse than it should be. It is high time the government ensured school admissions are proactively monitored to avoid this kind of selection by the backdoor.”

"

This advice is not for “UK” as it isn’t relevant to Scotland. We don’t have to apply for schools and are allocated a place in the catchment school. You can choose to apply for a placing request to another school, but you always get a place in your local school. Which seems like a far more sensible system than the shitshow in Engalnd.