Page 4 | SW London schools: info on Graveney, Chestnut, Hurlingham etc

PForParent · 2025-02-28T07:56:14+00:00

I would like to get some thoughts on secondary state schools in the Wandsworth area. We are ruling out single-sex schools, and super-strict schools like Ashcroft. Private schools or moving to another area are not realistic options, for a multitude of reasons. Our priority is to find a reasonable balance between a school which is reasonably rigorous, but not to the point that it crushes kids' spirit with petty, capricious, unnecessary rules and punishments. Eg think of the scandals at Holland Park School or Mossbourne, with well-documented cases of emotional abuse. Our impressions so far: *Graveney*: seems great if we can get in with the test (we appreciate it's not easy). *Chestnut *in Balham: seems less academic than Graveney but still a reasonable balance. *Ashcroft*: never ever ever. Detentions for cycling to school? Please. And the supposed "catch up" if you miss a day is bs: they simply put you in a detention room, there is no teaching. Way too much homework: the kids we know who go there have given up all their other activities, have stopped reading, that's really extreme. *Hurlingham Academy* in Fulham: Impressions were good. Seemed a reasonable balance. Some doubts about the school not having sixth form. *Saint Cecilia*: we know many families whose children are happy there. But it seems one of the least academic, and with very little homework (the opposite problem to Ashcroft) *Harris Wimbledon*: very mixed feedback. Some say it's a very good and very academic school, some say it's far too strict. *Harris Battersea*: very mixed feedback, but in the opposite sense to Harris Wimbledon: some say it's good, some say it's not academic enough. *Southfields Academy*: terrible impressions. The kids seemed feral. It seemed the least academic of the whole list. When sharing your thoughts, please: - respect our preferences. If Ashcroft or a single-sex works well for your kids, I am very happy for you, but don't try to convince me to send my kids there. If someone asks for a Chinese restaurant you don't tell them that Indian food is better :) - please try to take into account not just your personal experience, but how someone else's experience might differ. Eg our kids are reasonably happy at their primary, but I'll be the first to say it's one of those "my way or the highway" type of schools, and it's not a good choice for anyone with any kind of special needs Looking forward to hearing your thoughts! Thanks a lot!

Fellontheground · 05/03/2025 11:18

OP, I saw your posts elsewhere and I wasn’t surprised by the reaction to some of your comments. I do think you’re getting a little too granular on this whole thing. The reality is that most of the schools you have cited are good and children with motivated and engaged parents are likely to succeed. I know parents with DC at most of them too and all are happy.

However, I fear that none of these schools will quite measure up for you and you won’t be happy with any of them.

PatientVesta · 04/03/2025 15:07

PForParent · 04/03/2025 15:00

If I understand correctly, streaming means that children are divided into groups by ability, but there is one group for all subjects.

Sets means dividing by ability by subject.

Harris Wimbledon says on its website that it uses streams.
At Chestnut they use sets only for maths.

What do you know about St Cecilia? When I asked at the open day they said they use neither sets nor streams.

I don't know much, but they divide the classes based on ability, that is for sure because I also asked. What criteria they use I am not sure.
What I heard is that a lot of schools (if not all) use the SATs results to stream the children in year 7. Then they start using their own results.

Original poster

PForParent · 04/03/2025 15:00

If I understand correctly, streaming means that children are divided into groups by ability, but there is one group for all subjects.

Sets means dividing by ability by subject.

Harris Wimbledon says on its website that it uses streams.
At Chestnut they use sets only for maths.

What do you know about St Cecilia? When I asked at the open day they said they use neither sets nor streams.

OP posts:

PatientVesta · 04/03/2025 14:51

PForParent · 04/03/2025 14:16

Oh, I didn't remember about the music test, thanks for flagging.
May I ask what your views were on streaming?
Harris Wimbledon streams students.
Graveney puts them into sets for various subjects.
Chestnut uses sets for maths only.

In theory, I think sets make more sense than streams, because sets allow you to be in the top group for 1 subject but the middle. One for another.

In practice, I appreciate our choices may be limited so we cannot realistically rule out schools just because of sets vs streams

What do you mean by sets? Do you mean SATs results?

I have mixed feelings on streaming. I think it's great if your child is in the top stream, but not so great if they are not. The theory is that they learn better by being with children of similar abilities, however I think having mixed abilities also has its benefits. I'm on the fence on this one, but all schools seem to stream them one way or another, even St Cecilia's.

Original poster

PForParent · 04/03/2025 14:16

Oh, I didn't remember about the music test, thanks for flagging.
May I ask what your views were on streaming?
Harris Wimbledon streams students.
Graveney puts them into sets for various subjects.
Chestnut uses sets for maths only.

In theory, I think sets make more sense than streams, because sets allow you to be in the top group for 1 subject but the middle. One for another.

In practice, I appreciate our choices may be limited so we cannot realistically rule out schools just because of sets vs streams

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PatientVesta · 04/03/2025 13:25

PForParent · 04/03/2025 12:05

Harris Wimbledon has this weird system with 3 nodal points and in 2024 we would have just barely got in based on distance. This year, no clue.

Harris Wimbledon would be ca 30 minutes by public transport. Harris Battersea probably 40-45, as traffic is worse and the bus service is less reliable.

Does your child do any music at all? Their music test is a theory test, which we were totally not prepared to. But DC passed and that's how we got the place.

PatientVesta · 04/03/2025 12:38

Yes, the transport links to Harris Wimbledon are great. There are lots of buses, there is the northern line, there is Wimbledon station (a bit of a walk but totally doable), which has National Rail, district line and trams.
I think you are spot-on about people deluding themselves. I hear very bad things about Ashcroft as well. Yes their results might be good on paper, but I didn't even consider it to my child (for the reasons outlined above) and we are very aspirational. We would have gone private (as we both did), but opted not to. The decision was not just financial, it was also to give our children a sense of reality and not be brought up entitled and in a bubble. Finally, it's also the positive discrimination aspect, being white middle class, they would totally be in the "discarded" category.

Original poster

PForParent · 04/03/2025 12:24

PS interesting to note that, when I asked the same question in a local forum, I was totally crucified for daring criticise Ashcroft.

My sense is that some people are so invested in deluding themselves that their children's school is the best, that wherever they live is the best area etc, that they see any criticism or different opinion as a threat

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Original poster

PForParent · 04/03/2025 12:05

Harris Wimbledon has this weird system with 3 nodal points and in 2024 we would have just barely got in based on distance. This year, no clue.

Harris Wimbledon would be ca 30 minutes by public transport. Harris Battersea probably 40-45, as traffic is worse and the bus service is less reliable.

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PatientVesta · 04/03/2025 11:50

PForParent · 04/03/2025 11:41

Yes, absolutely. Southfields Academy is completely unrelated to the Harris federation.

However, both Harris Battersea and Southfields Academy are under subscribed.

My understanding is that Southfields doesn't have a great reputation, but some commenters have had good experiences.

More surprising that Harris Battersea remains under subscribed even after being rated outstanding in 2023. Hopefully it's more to do with the demographics (rich families going private + many childless households there?) than the quality of the schools. We will try to look into it.

I honestly think it is to do with demographics in Battersea. But as I said, we didn't look into it. Where about roughly are you? It's quite a distance to Wimbledon so I'm surprised you are looking at both?

Original poster

PForParent · 04/03/2025 11:41

Yes, absolutely. Southfields Academy is completely unrelated to the Harris federation.

However, both Harris Battersea and Southfields Academy are under subscribed.

My understanding is that Southfields doesn't have a great reputation, but some commenters have had good experiences.

More surprising that Harris Battersea remains under subscribed even after being rated outstanding in 2023. Hopefully it's more to do with the demographics (rich families going private + many childless households there?) than the quality of the schools. We will try to look into it.

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PatientVesta · 04/03/2025 11:37

PForParent · 04/03/2025 09:28

Yes, yes, absolutely, I am being realistic.

Our child is doing decently on the preparation for the test, but we are not deluding ourselves thinking it's a slam dunk. We know that it's not, and that competition is very tough. In fact, it is hard to get a sense, because AFAIK the council doesn't publish the percentiles, i.e. it tells you that you needed a score of, say, 247 to get into Graveney, but not if that score corresponded to the top 2% or top 6% or what.

In terms of odds, I would say that:

Graveney: only if she does well in the test, so no slam dunk

Chestnut: easier because it's easier to be in the top band at Chestnut than getting into Graveney, but no slam dunk either

Huurlingham and St Cecilia: much more likely based on recent history. Only in 2020 in St Cecilia would we not have got in. Based on the preliminary March numbers just published, we wouldn't have got in either, but then there are more siblings than in the past, and in the past the waiting list has always moved a lot

Harris Wimbledon: can't find the more recent data anywhere

Harris Battersea and Southfields are undersubscribed. Some say they are good schools anyway, some say it's a bad sign. I don't know.

To be clear, I am not assuming an exodus; if anything, the opposite: I fear that waiting lists will move less than in the past if the VAT hike convinces fewer people to go private

Edited

Just to clarify, there is no Harris Southfields, there is Southfields Academy, which is NOT part of the Harris Federation. Southfields Academy doesn't have a reputation and we didn't even consider it.

PatientVesta · 04/03/2025 11:12

PForParent · 04/03/2025 11:01

@PatientVesta your comment about Harris vs Ashcroft is very valuable for us, thanks a lot.

For us it is very important that someone who values discipline but disapproves of Ashcroft finds that Harris Wimbledon is a more reasonable compromise. To be clear, you got the sense that rules at Harris Wimbledon were strict but fair, right? Not like Ashcroft?

PS single sex schools are not for us, but thanks for pointing out the option

You appear to think exactly like us. We 100% value discipline and think it's essential, but Ashcroft goes too far.
For example, I agree with the no phone rule, but to deny children to have a phone on their way to school is unreasonable in this day an age, especially for safety reasons.
We also ruled out single-sex schools, but thought was worth mentioning.
As for Harris, I think you would not be disappointed. I know parents with children there and they are pleased. Hard-working professional parents, which I think eventually will influence the school results, so it's a win-win.

Original poster

PForParent · 04/03/2025 11:01

@PatientVesta your comment about Harris vs Ashcroft is very valuable for us, thanks a lot.

For us it is very important that someone who values discipline but disapproves of Ashcroft finds that Harris Wimbledon is a more reasonable compromise. To be clear, you got the sense that rules at Harris Wimbledon were strict but fair, right? Not like Ashcroft?

PS single sex schools are not for us, but thanks for pointing out the option

OP posts:

PatientVesta · 04/03/2025 10:56

Not sure if you have girls at all, but Ursuline High School for Girls in Wimbledon is also a great choice, so is Ricards Lodge.

PatientVesta · 04/03/2025 10:53

PForParent · 04/03/2025 10:38

@PatientVesta,
I disagree on the importance of Latin. I think learning a modern language is incredibly more useful, but that is neither here nor there in the great scheme of things (Italians study ancient Latin and ancient Greek in some schools, but they are notoriously worse at modern languages than the Scandinavians, who don't). If state schools all offered Latin, private schools would start offering ancient hieroglyphs just to differentiate themselves :)

May I ask if you found data on admission distances anywhere? I didn't find it on Merton's website, and the school only published the 2023 data.

Have you had a chance to compare Harris Wimbledon with Ashcroft and Graveney? In a local forum I was crucified for criticising Ashcroft, and told that Graveney and Harris Wimbledon have a similar attitude to discipline and detention. That's the first I hear of it. Would you agree with this?

Lastly, it may be too far for you, but have you ever looked into Harris Battersea? It is rated outstanding but remains undersubscribed, which I find odd. Some say that it's a good school regardless and some say it's undersubscribed for a reason.

It's obviously very personal, I think Latin is a great base. They offer modern European languages too, (French and Spanish from memory, but also others as after school clubs). They are also very strong in drama.
We completely ruled out Ashcroft and didn't even put it on our list. Both my husband and I hated it during the open day and we found the location very inconvenient, despite the good results. Our neighbour's kids go there and are happy, but I also heard of kids having nervous breakdowns there, so it wasn't for us.
Graveney was our first choice, but the WT results our child got (235) mean that probably there is no chance of getting a place. It's also a huge school, which could be a shock coming from a small primary.
We didn't look at Harris Battersea due to location, Wimbledon is better for us. But I also think that being undersubscribed could be due to demographics; it's an area that is more and more gentrified, a lot of children might be going private and other residents might be older without school age children.
St Cecilia seems a great school when you visit, and the pastoral care is wonderful. But the results are not that good so I wasn't very impressed. The location isn't very convenient either, not many buses and only the tube, so it was far down our list in the end (even though we would 100% get a place on the religious criterion).

ButIDontLikePeas · 04/03/2025 10:45

PForParent · 04/03/2025 10:38

@PatientVesta,
I disagree on the importance of Latin. I think learning a modern language is incredibly more useful, but that is neither here nor there in the great scheme of things (Italians study ancient Latin and ancient Greek in some schools, but they are notoriously worse at modern languages than the Scandinavians, who don't). If state schools all offered Latin, private schools would start offering ancient hieroglyphs just to differentiate themselves :)

May I ask if you found data on admission distances anywhere? I didn't find it on Merton's website, and the school only published the 2023 data.

Have you had a chance to compare Harris Wimbledon with Ashcroft and Graveney? In a local forum I was crucified for criticising Ashcroft, and told that Graveney and Harris Wimbledon have a similar attitude to discipline and detention. That's the first I hear of it. Would you agree with this?

Lastly, it may be too far for you, but have you ever looked into Harris Battersea? It is rated outstanding but remains undersubscribed, which I find odd. Some say that it's a good school regardless and some say it's undersubscribed for a reason.

Merton doesn't publish academy or church school data (which is really annoying as they are the majority of schools in the borough 🙄). They just tell you to ask the school directly.

ButIDontLikePeas · 04/03/2025 10:42

PatientVesta · 04/03/2025 10:02

Arriving a bit late for this topic. I can't say for personal experience yet, but my child has just been offered a place at Harris Wimbledon. My impressions were very good on the open day.
All children looked happy, the head is passionate and on the ball. The school is brand new, so the building will be solid and no asbestos (it's a thing, do some research). I also know of parents that have children there and they are very pleased with the school. Harris are the best performing academies in the country, they do a lot of cross school sports tournaments with other Harris schools. It's also the only school I visited that teaches Latin, which I think it's huge, people underestimate how Latin is important as the base of so many modern European languages
The only negative thing I can think of for now is the location; it is not the nicest looking area (South WImbledon), very industrial and near busy roads. But the school itself is facing a quiet road. It's also not as big as other schools, so not much of an outside area, but this is not necessarily a bad thing coming from a small primary school.

Harris Wimbledon is our nearest school so although we are a way off secondary for DD1, we are watching how it progresses carefully. It's just such a shame (imo) that it only offers Spanish as its MFL. I studied French, German and Russian at my standard comp in the north of England (also the option for Spanish but I never took that one) and I would like my DC to also have a bit of a choice. Seems that schools have really pulled back on MFL.

Original poster

PForParent · 04/03/2025 10:40

@minimiffy how does the waiting list work, exactly?

Let's say that in March I am offered Harris Battersea, which is not my top preference.

I must still accept it, right?

Then the council will tell me if I move up the waiting list at Chestnut?

So I can still accept Chestnut in August, even if I accepted Harris Battersea in March?

OP posts:

Original poster

PForParent · 04/03/2025 10:38

@PatientVesta,
I disagree on the importance of Latin. I think learning a modern language is incredibly more useful, but that is neither here nor there in the great scheme of things (Italians study ancient Latin and ancient Greek in some schools, but they are notoriously worse at modern languages than the Scandinavians, who don't). If state schools all offered Latin, private schools would start offering ancient hieroglyphs just to differentiate themselves :)

May I ask if you found data on admission distances anywhere? I didn't find it on Merton's website, and the school only published the 2023 data.

Have you had a chance to compare Harris Wimbledon with Ashcroft and Graveney? In a local forum I was crucified for criticising Ashcroft, and told that Graveney and Harris Wimbledon have a similar attitude to discipline and detention. That's the first I hear of it. Would you agree with this?

Lastly, it may be too far for you, but have you ever looked into Harris Battersea? It is rated outstanding but remains undersubscribed, which I find odd. Some say that it's a good school regardless and some say it's undersubscribed for a reason.

OP posts:

minimiffy · 04/03/2025 10:27

Re request for thoughts on Graveney and Chestnut Grove

Just chiming in that everyone I know who got into Graveney was tutored, and it's very competitive.

If you look at Chestnut Grove and specifically at the results by prior attainment - those who are rated high (and would be admitted under Band A) are doing well. www.compare-school-performance.service.gov.uk/school/136883/chestnut-grove-academy/secondary/results-by-pupil-characteristics?accordionstate=1
Looking at this specific breakdown across schools was a much better comparison for me than just looking at the overall average grade.

Band A does really move - but it does involve waiting until end of August, which can be quite torturous as there will be no movement for ages and then a sudden update on the website. We were offered right at the end but turned it down as DC felt committed to another school by that point.

I know people who are there under language and arts places and they like it. I personally think Chestnut Grove is a great option very comparable to Graveney.

spoodlesee · 04/03/2025 10:07

Graveney offers latin but that may be A-level

PatientVesta · 04/03/2025 10:02

Arriving a bit late for this topic. I can't say for personal experience yet, but my child has just been offered a place at Harris Wimbledon. My impressions were very good on the open day.
All children looked happy, the head is passionate and on the ball. The school is brand new, so the building will be solid and no asbestos (it's a thing, do some research). I also know of parents that have children there and they are very pleased with the school. Harris are the best performing academies in the country, they do a lot of cross school sports tournaments with other Harris schools. It's also the only school I visited that teaches Latin, which I think it's huge, people underestimate how Latin is important as the base of so many modern European languages
The only negative thing I can think of for now is the location; it is not the nicest looking area (South WImbledon), very industrial and near busy roads. But the school itself is facing a quiet road. It's also not as big as other schools, so not much of an outside area, but this is not necessarily a bad thing coming from a small primary school.

todayortomorrow · 04/03/2025 09:43

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/wandsworth_year_6_test_scores_20

This is old, from the days when it was compulsory, but interesting to get a feel for actual score distribution.

Agree with all that it will be informative to see what happens to the graveney number over the summer. I expect it to be similar to last year so around 240 by September.

On the grandparents point, if 1/3 of private fees in the UK are paid by grandparents, I could imagine that up to 1/2 of wandsworth secondary fees are - and that demographic are not very price sensitive.

Wandsworth Year 6 test scores 2013 - a Freedom of Information request to Wandsworth Borough Council

I would like to know where my child is compared to his local peers. Would you please publish a graph showing the distribution of test results with the "number of students" and the score. Thank you Yours faithfully, JP Torre

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/wandsworth_year_6_test_scores_20

spoodlesee · 04/03/2025 09:39

It will be interesting to see if this yrs score drops much over the Summer because the kids got places at grammar's or privates.