DS failed 11+ very upset, angry and sad

It was just a simple illustration of my point that you can improve anything with training but up to a certain level.

God forbid! 😂

How common is that these days? I've never had them in IT, is that for accounting?

There won't be much workforce left soon so HR with their crazy ideas will become obsolete.

There should be Olympic category for running with short legs too why not ? :))

Why

I haven't even mentioned the essay writing part of the LNAT either.

@Overturnedmum - you have just deliberately quoted one bit of the LNAT. Kids who excel at VR at 10, typically excel at VR at 16 and 18 too. It really is not a controversial thing to say.
Plenty of kids do not sit VR at 10/11 - that is a separate issue.

Clearly, whoever said this had no clue about the vast difference between the LNAT exam and the 11+ VR.

The LNAT demands deep, analytical reasoning and composition skills, while the VR test hinges on more straightforward linguistic and logical skills.

LNAT Example:
Read the following passage:
"The right to freedom of speech is fundamental to democracy. However, this right is not absolute and can be restricted in cases of hate speech. Critics argue that limiting speech can lead to a slippery slope where more and more expressions are curtailed, undermining the essence of free speech."
Question:
Why do critics oppose restrictions on speech?

• A) They believe all speech should be restricted.
• B) They fear it could lead to more limitations on free speech.
• C) They think democracy should have no boundaries.
• D) They agree with restrictions on hate speech.

11+ VR Example:
Question:
Find the missing word in the following sequence:
cat, dog, _, fish
Options:

• A) mouse
• B) bird
• C) elephant
• D) snake

https://lnat.ac.uk/ - LNAT for law, it will retest verbal reasoning. If you have a DC who got 100 per cent in verbal reasoning at 11 plus with not much practice, you will also know they are very likely to pass LNAT and make a good lawyer.

There are psychometric and job aptitude tests that test NVR including spatial reasoning and technical ability.

The 11+ exam isn't at Olympic level, not even at Olympic level for a 10-year-old child, whose leg muscles haven't fully developed yet. Even short leg grow differently for different kids at that stage.

You can train practically everything, but some things only to a certain point. You will never become an Olympic runner if you have short legs.

It is of course possible to teach the rules of analysing matrices but it's going to be verbal reasoning in your head vs. an instant reaction of an autistic brain for which it's just obvious the first millisecond.

Yes, tutoring for this has no use IRL beyond 11+.

It looks like you're confusing it with VR.

Non-verbal should be alot easier fo who can comprehend, infer the text, words, sentences in well rounded learning in my opinion. That is why Autistic kids must be showing the same, they need inclusive cohort / or pareents to develop verbal.

Practicing NVR can significantly improve performance. The more you practice, the better you become at recognizing patterns, understanding abstract question patterns, and solving problems quickly. In a way, similar to classical conditioning involves learning through repeated associations, and practicing NVR questions repeatedly helps the brain recognize patterns and improve speeds.

However this skillet is of little use outside for the sake of NVR exam really.

It's not strange at all - NVR is designed to test pattern recognition, it has nothing to do with comprehension of words, sentences etc. That's exactly why it's called non-verbal.

Tutoring can improve NVR only by a few points - your brain has to work in a certain way to be good at NVR. My autistic DC1 does NVR in 30% of time and finds it very easy. He got top scores for grammar with zero prep. Again, this has nothing to do with reading.

I don't want to take your dc example, but Isn't it strange that who has very good comprehensive skills can not handle non-verbal that easily ? kids who read widely for pleasure and curiosity doesn't need non-verbal practice or exam technic practice separately in that case.

Remembering the bright young things I knew 15 or more years ago who had a crack at Tiffin, so many advanced, avid and fluent early readers who had no tutoring didn't get in. The ones who did had oodles of tuition, some from year 4. Yes there'll always be outraged outliers who claim to have done it without. But among those 'failures' who ended up at the likes of Teddington, were eventual Cambridge, Bristol and Durham grads. So all was well thankfully for those lovely children.

I don't think you could get a grammar place with just reading - DD is a bookworm, has been reading non-stop since 4, and books far above expected reading age. We did zero prep as I've never considered a grammar school for her, but had to register last minute because of VAT. She did 5 mock tests on Atom and sat for Henrietta - of course she didn't get through. Her comprehension on Atom was very high, but NVR was average and reading cannot really help with this.

There are plenty of clever kids at comp
plenty of well behaved kids
plenty of conforming children that actively want to and enjoy learning.
just because they didn’t attain the required grade on that hour on that day at the age of 10.

😂You are right.. its ridiculous, I think I was in a silly mood when I chose it, but never worked out how to change it now.

So what about the children who don't piss around at school, do their homework, are exceptionally polite, helpful and hardworking, but don't have the academic ability to go to grammar school? Should they be tossed in a class full of disruptive, unruly children? I've just described one of the children in my class- and I can totally see the unfairness in her not getting a good education when she's in secondary. She's not a piss artist, just not clever enough to get into grammar.

So wise @DuckbilledSplatterPuff (despite your thoroughly daft name!). This is how to frame it.

A grammar we know of has regularly 1000 kids in 10 k radius taking the entry exam for less than 150 places. Entry is based on priority catchment and highest score.
850 kids are not failures.
The score doesn't matter, you either make the top 150 or you don't.
Many then go into the top sets of state comprehensives. Some of which use the same kinds of tests (amongst other things) on Year 7s to help with setting. These schools get good GCSE and A level results and places at Russell Group unis on competitive courses. If you know what you want to aim for, there is always a way, its just taking a different route. Some get offered sixth form places at the grammar due to good A level results.

So your son's work is not wasted. One on one learning is always useful.
The last years of primary school are so stressful for parents and children. I was glad when that aspect of it was over.

If that's the case the primaries would have been a safe place for everyone and wouldn't be pushed other children into home tutions. or school changes.